Hard Light Productions Forums
Community Projects => The FreeSpace Upgrade Project => Topic started by: Hellstryker on March 11, 2008, 06:43:21 pm
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Now correct me if im wrong, this thing was either prometheus sized and white or yellow inside with a blue glow surrounding it. The current one looks something like a vasudan laser! cmon can't you do better than this?
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I have complained about this and the Maxim more times than I can remember. :p They frankly look like crap, especially compared to all the other weapons. Hopefully the final 3.6.10 package will at least have them reverted to the retail versions.
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If it doesn't ill make em myself and upload the table info here...
Edit: Whats the big deal with the maxim? the prometheus is uglier..
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Just look at it and compare it to the original. The original one fired massive, elongated blue projectiles that often took up a good chunk of the screen when firing, while the new one shoots these sad little BBs that are barely visible. It looks just like that effect you used to get in retail FS2 if you tried to fire beams from a fighter. I still think that this is a bug and the Maxim was never intended to look like this, but these weapons have been this way for so long (at least three years now) that many people have probably forgotten what the original ones were like and think this is normal. :p
In the past, I resorted to using a modified tbm with only these two effects removed, but the 3.6.10 package will be used in multiplayer and this will no longer be possible there.
The Prometheus guns look okay to me, although the glow effects should be a bit larger to match the originals.
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I thought the MediaVPs Maxim was okay. For a "ballistic" weapon, blue colour just doesn't look right to me... one white dot for the bullet and a near-invisible glow effect that acts as a muzzleflash of sorts... and I hardly use the Circe and the Lamprey anyway (but I'm fine with the effects as they are. :lol:)
No quibbles with the Prometheus guns...
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It's not ballistic, but just feels like it. The game describes it as "by definition an energy weapon." Anyway, the new version is still blue if you can actually see it. The Maxim was easily the coolest player-allowed weapon in FS2, just in terms of the graphics and sound effects, but the media VP version looks like some wimpy pea shooter. The same applies to the Circe.
The weapons shouldn't deviate this much from the originals in any case. They're supposed to be improved versions, not entirely new concepts. (and the others do follow this rule very well)
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Could you post a screenshot of the original circe and maxim here to jog some people memories?
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Some ships lab shots below.
MVP Maxim (dunno why it looks even worse than in game):
(http://www.joskus.jossain.com/maxim_mvp.jpg)
MVP Circe (the animation is kinda cool. Too bad it's practically invisible in-game):
(http://www.joskus.jossain.com/circe_mvp.jpg)
Retail Maxim:
(http://www.joskus.jossain.com/maxim_retail.jpg)
Retail Circe:
(http://www.joskus.jossain.com/circe_retail.jpg)
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The difference is considerable...
...no doubt the MVPs succeded, overall, in covering the presence of not-that-good Circe and Maxim textures ;)
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Could you post a screenshot of the original circe and maxim here to jog some people memories?
It's hard to see the full extent of the difference in screenshots, especially from the lab. It has to be seen in motion at the angle they come out of your ship. The best thing is to make a blank mission and compare for yourself.
MVP Maxim (dunno why it looks even worse than in game):
I think it only shows the first frame of the animation in the lab, which is blank for the Maxim effect. Although it doesn't look much better in the game.
MVP Circe (the animation is kinda cool. Too bad it's practically invisible in-game):
The animation is good, but it doesn't look like the Circe at all. It would be more appropriate for the Lamprey.
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I really wish either of these weapons was actually effective.
(Although a circle maxim combo is good for shivan bombers)
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MVP Maxim (dunno why it looks even worse than in game):
I think it only shows the first frame of the animation in the lab, which is blank for the Maxim effect. Although it doesn't look much better in the game.
Yea, I guess you're right, I didn't even realize it was animated :rolleyes:
As for the Circe, It looks to me like it would serve well as a Morning Star effect, as it is now.
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I got no problem with either gun. ;)
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Maxim is a ballistic weapon. The way it looks when you shoot it sort of fits that. Just a high powered fast moving stream of uranium slugs. Just that the visual affects for it currently in the mvp's make it seem like tiny fighter mounted smg. The effect would look nicer if it were looking like say a high caliber automatic machine gun firing at night, and also if the projectiles don't look like BB's as well.
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Maybe this is one case where we should just let Volition's effects stay. :drevil:
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Don't know about that... I fear it'll all break down to a difference of opinion... :doubt:
I do like the size of the retail Maxim rounds though, big and bad, if only for a while, then the blue colour ends up looking really weird to me... but I think that increasing the size of the MediaVPs ones might not be the solution to the problem (at least for my picky self anyway, pardon me (http://209.85.12.236/5024/118/emo/bangwall.gif)).
Oh well... :o
...no doubt the MVPs succeded, overall, in covering the presence of not-that-good Circe and Maxim textures ;)
Half a mind to agree...
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Ok ok... I'll work on the Circe...
I've already worked on the Maxim.
(http://i7.tinypic.com/80noqj9.jpg)
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Bah, I was just in the process of telling them how you've already awesomeified the maxim. :p
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Ok ok... I'll work on the Circe...
I've already worked on the Maxim.
(http://i7.tinypic.com/80noqj9.jpg)
You should add ring trails like the railgun in INFA :D
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Those blue rounds remind me of the Underworld-style gun skins for CS Source... :nervous: :yes:
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I redid the Maxim effects in the style of INF:A railguns for Twist of Fate, as shown below:
(http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/9108/maximqp1.png)
The effects files and table entry are attached to my post. The table entry has an FS1-style technobabble tech description and references a damage bar graph loadout ani instead of the green grid thing, as it was taken from Twist of Fate. I find that the trails greatly help aiming. The blue isn't as bright as the retail version (pale effects are something I'm using a lot in Twist of Fate), but that would be very easy to fix.
[attachment deleted by ninja]
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looks better without the railgun rings effect. Easier on the eyes too....
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The rings give it commonality with the INF:A railguns I'm using, as it's supposed to be a railgun as well.
In action, the rings go pretty much all the way down the trail, and are farther spread apart. Maxims are difficult to get a good screenshot of because of their velocity.
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Maxims are difficult to get a good screenshot of because of their velocity.
Use cheats and slow down time, that's what I do when trying for a screenshot of a weapon.
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The new maxim DaBrain posted looks much better than the current one, but I can't really get an idea of its scale from that screenshot. I have a feeling the projectile needs to be somewhat longer to be close enough to the original though.
As people said earlier, time compression helps a lot for getting close up shots of weapons. I would especially like to see how it looks from the cockpit of something like the Serapis, in which you can see the shots really close up when firing it.
I don't think the rings look good either, especially on something moving so fast. The Akheton also has rings already and it would look a little strange for both of them to be using the same effect when the weapons don't have anything in common otherwise.
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Well, I wanted to do a miniature of the INF:A railguns, which had rings perhaps because of the railguns = glowing rings tradition started by Quake II. At any rate, the rings are always blue instead of changing color like the Akheton's. What about the vapor trail, though? I find it to be effective for precision aiming as well as looking cool.
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The rings give it commonality with the INF:A railguns I'm using, as it's supposed to be a railgun as well.
:wtf: ... Must....resist....flaming...comment....
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The rings give it commonality with the INF:A railguns I'm using, as it's supposed to be a railgun as well.
:wtf: ... Must....resist....flaming...comment....
Um, the Maxim tech description indicates that it's either a railgun or a coilgun:
a high-velocity mass-driver cannon, accelerating uranium slugs along its smoothbore barrel
As for the "by definition an energy weapon" part of the description, railguns use electricity to fire, which could be drawn from the ship's capacitor.
Also, without the capship railguns, pre-beam cannon capship battles are incredibly, painfully dull.
FS1-style Maxim tech description I wrote for TOF:
Adapted from capital ship railgun technology ; rapidly fires depleted uranium hypervelocity slugs. High velocity and efficient railgun technology ensure accuracy at ranges of up to three kilometers. The Maxim is designed to damage capital ships and incapacitate subsystems and turrets. Maxim rounds are optimized for physical targets - attacks on shielded fighters are ineffective.
The Maxim is the ultimate anti-warship weapon for a fighter. Compact, very long-ranged, and massively powerful, the Maxim is designed to allow fighters to fire on capital ships from a safe distance. High energy consumption, low shield damage, and strong recoil lessen the effectiveness of the Maxim somewhat, but it is still an invaluable weapon.
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I redid the Maxim effects in the style of INF:A railguns for Twist of Fate, as shown below:
(http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/9108/maximqp1.png)
The effects files and table entry are attached to my post. The table entry has an FS1-style technobabble tech description and references a damage bar graph loadout ani instead of the green grid thing, as it was taken from Twist of Fate. I find that the trails greatly help aiming. The blue isn't as bright as the retail version (pale effects are something I'm using a lot in Twist of Fate), but that would be very easy to fix.
Perfect
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Why do railguns have to have rings? You can't even see the railgun rounds when they're fired. Or at least that's how it is in RL.
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They're cool...and RL is separate from FS.
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Why do railguns have to have rings? You can't even see the railgun rounds when they're fired. Or at least that's how it is in RL.
I blame this :p
(http://www.musashionline.com/graphics/railgun.jpg)
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The rings give it commonality with the INF:A railguns I'm using, as it's supposed to be a railgun as well.
:wtf: ... Must....resist....flaming...comment....
Um, the Maxim tech description indicates that it's either a railgun or a coilgun:
Flaming reason = INF
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What's your problem with Inferno?
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Sorry to rain on people's parade here. I got corrected years ago on the maxim as well.
Reconstruction efforts after the Great War inspired advancements in metallurgy and efficient conventional explosives. The two are elegantly combined in the GTW-66 Maxim. The Maxim is by definition an energy weapon, though it behaves like a high-velocity mass-driver cannon, accelerating uranium slugs along its smoothbore barrel. The Maxim has a difficult time penetrating energy-based shields, but it has a devastating effect on hull plating and subsystem armor.
It's just a big smooth bore barrelled gun that uses explosion powered bullets, and caseless ammunition at that too. It's no railgun or coil gun.
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I like DaBrain's new version. Rings don't really agree with my impression of how weapon fire should look in freespace. They're just too, well, cartoony for my taste.
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Rings should definitely be gotten rid of and possibly make it look like the maxim actually spits out bullets would be a first too.
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I think the original effect was pretty awesome, honestly...
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Sorry to rain on people's parade here. I got corrected years ago on the maxim as well.
Reconstruction efforts after the Great War inspired advancements in metallurgy and efficient conventional explosives. The two are elegantly combined in the GTW-66 Maxim. The Maxim is by definition an energy weapon, though it behaves like a high-velocity mass-driver cannon, accelerating uranium slugs along its smoothbore barrel. The Maxim has a difficult time penetrating energy-based shields, but it has a devastating effect on hull plating and subsystem armor.
It's just a big smooth bore barrelled gun that uses explosion powered bullets, and caseless ammunition at that too. It's no railgun or coil gun.
The explosives could be in the bullets. Why would it consume energy otherwise? The most logical explanation is that it is a railgun or coilgun that fires explosive shells.
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Conventional explosives don't necessarily mean chemical explosives in 2365.
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There is electronic firing systems for caseless rounds. Which means that it needs energy to operate. I'm pretty sure the maxim isn't a railgun because of the fact that railguns require the use of the payload sliding across charged rails. A coil gun does not need rails.
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I said it could also be a coilgun, but for Twist of Fate I assumed it was a a railgun because I had other railguns in the mod already. Plus the glowing blue rings are cool.
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Technically there's no reason a railgun should have glowing blue rings, but I'm assuming you're saying it's a cool artistic convention?
I do rather agree with that.
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I said it could also be a coilgun, but for Twist of Fate I assumed it was a a railgun because I had other railguns in the mod already. Plus the glowing blue rings are cool.
But anyways, I would love to know why any of us should make the Maxim have any commonality with your mod at all, since, after all, it's a mod vs. the main game.
Which is what TrashMan should have said, but didn't, because he's TrashMan.
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Oh, I did say that, only in far fewer words. Anyone who pushes INF as canon or important deserves to die.
Speaking of which, you insult will not go unpunished.
*sodomises ngtm1r with a morningstar*
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Only the admins round here get to deal out punishments so rein it in.
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Oh, I did say that, only in far fewer words. Anyone who pushes INF as canon or important deserves to die.
Speaking of which, you insult will not go unpunished.
*sodomises ngtm1r with a morningstar*
I didn't say INF was canon. Have you stopped taking your medication?
But anyways, I would love to know why any of us should make the Maxim have any commonality with your mod at all, since, after all, it's a mod vs. the main game.
I was really wanting you to adopt it not because it's used by my mod, but because it's cool. :D
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Only the admins round here get to deal out punishments so rein it in.
No problem. I'm done anyway.
*hands Kaj the bloody morningstar*
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maxim is no railgun or coilgun.
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Proof? Or will you just talk out of your ass? The Maxim consumes large amounts of ship energy and fires ammunition. Therefore, whatever fires the ammunition is drawing power directly from the ship's capacitor bank. This is almost certainly an electronic firing system like...a railgun or coilgun. The explosives are IN the shells so that the shells make big booms and do more damage.
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Caseless ammunition also has an eletric firing system. Also it just says that there was advancements in metalurgy and efficient conventional explosives. After this there's the fact that guns also use efficient conventional explosives to drive a bullet.
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The incredible amount of energy used by Maxim is far, far more than sufficient to ignite a powder charge. It's extreme overkill. You'd only need that much juice to power a railgun or coilgun. The thing uses as much energy as SIX Subachs. The gun also does not make the "bang" a propellant charge would.
The Maxim's firing characteristics, energy consumption, and description make NO sense aside from an electrodynamic mass driver.
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I agree that it's a railgun/coilgun.
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I agree that it's a railgun/coilgun.
:yes:
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The incredible amount of energy used by Maxim is far, far more than sufficient to ignite a powder charge. It's extreme overkill. You'd only need that much juice to power a railgun or coilgun. The thing uses as much energy as SIX Subachs. The gun also does not make the "bang" a propellant charge would.
The Maxim's firing characteristics, energy consumption, and description make NO sense aside from an electrodynamic mass driver.
Now this is pure speculation as far as delving into the unkowns of the fs universe anyone can't consider. We don't know what conventional explosives are in the fs universe (aside from bombs). And you're really not thinking about how energy intensive a gun would need to be to require an electronic system (Gattling gun/mini gun comes to mind). That much energy isn't just used for burning the powder to expel a bullet, but is also used to support the high rapid firing rates of big automatic guns. The maxim is a big high rate of fire gun (so why not consider this?).
However it does not have rail propelled ammunition, so it's not a railgun. The other thing is that it's quite clear that the maxim spits out bullets. Another thing to keep in mind is that in the scp the maxim gets replaced from using weapons energy to actually firing bullets that you need to reload. if it spits out bullets why does it need to even use the weapons energy of your fighter? One is for the drive system of the ammunition. Two is for the fact that V didn't do a very good job making a bullet spitting weapon. They made an awesome weapon, but they never put into the game a bullet counter so you know how much ammunition you have left, and instead tied the maxim down to your weapon energy exclusively (SCP fixed this).
The maxim does have a smoothbore barrel. So since it's not a railgun, then it's most likely a coilgun or a normal gun. And since the tech description doesn't much bother with mentioning something as big of a detail as explosive tipped bullets, but rather only mentions conventional explosives once...that doesn't leave much either in the area of explosive tipped bullets. If maxim bullets were explosive tipped, i'm pretty sure the tech description would say it outright since that's a pretty main characteristic of the gun as well as the fact that it uses bullets. The tech description for the maxim is horrible.
But you can deduce that it's not a railgun (no rails). So that leaves a coilgun (most likely). And the detailess conventional explosives being mentioned (this detail doesn't suggest much at all). So there you have it. It's a coilgun! And at least i'm looking for an explanation to why it is as opposed to you woolie wool going off and saying nothing more than "IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN!IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN!IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN!IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN!IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN!IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN!IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN!IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN! IT'S A RAILGUN/COILGUN!....S-99's just talking out of his ass again".
Proof? Or will you just talk out of your ass?
At least i was providing something dumb****.
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You're right, the mention of efficient conventional explosives is puzzling and a bit of a contradiction.
However, the in-game fact of weapon energy usage suggests it's a coilgun because it uses massive amounts of energy whereas real-life caseless weapons barely require any power.
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Another thing to keep in mind is that in the scp the maxim gets replaced from using weapons energy to actually firing bullets that you need to reload
No, it doesn't. The SCP allows you to make weapons that use ammunition, but it most certainly does not change the maxim to behave that way.
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Proof? Or will you just talk out of your ass?
At least i was providing something dumb****.
Cool it down, guys.
What the Maxim is supposed to be or how it operates is irrelevant here anyway. The original effect is canonical and the media VP one should bear at least some resemblance to it, enough that you can still recognize it as a Maxim.
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Rail guns is just not the way to go when making electronic weapons. Those rails get an enormous amount of friction with the ammunition needing to slide on them.
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Rail guns is just not the way to go when making electronic weapons. Those rails get an enormous amount of friction with the ammunition needing to slide on them.
Depends what kind of material the rails are made out of. we don't know what sort of uber heat resistant metal they may have 365 years from now. of course i agree it's a coilgun anyway so you may as well ignore this post
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I would assume it is a railgun/coilgun because it "accelerates" the things, it doesn't "blast" them...
Also, I find myself agreeing with TrashMan somewhat: don't make the Maxim compatible with Inferno, make Inferno compatible with the Maxim.
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ofcourse, there are other possiblities for EM accelerators than just railguns and coilguns....
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Why do railguns have to have rings? You can't even see the railgun rounds when they're fired. Or at least that's how it is in RL.
I blame this :p
(http://www.musashionline.com/graphics/railgun.jpg)
:lol: Me too.
(http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/9108/maximqp1.png)
This is trash and it belongs in the trash. The fact it's used for INF just proves it. (http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2006/05/22) It's like Maxim got infected with a strain of AIDS. And lensflare. No offense to the creator, it's an admirable effort, but just... just no. No.
(http://i7.tinypic.com/80noqj9.jpg)
For the mother-****ing win, yes, a thousand times yes. More things need that double-triple layered glow to happen to them, like 3.6.10 did with the Tempests and... other things.
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The term "slug" implies an inert mass. . . . . . . . .at least to me. Sounds like the "explosives" used would be to propel the slug. Hence the screen shudder etc. :nervous- not: a mass driver just means it lobs matter in a linear velocity. It doesn't have to do it in any particular way. :)
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Um, no, the slug could be accelerated by electromagnetic forces. Powder-charge cannons don't make pew-pew-pew noises and drain as much energy as 6 Subachs.
This is trash and it belongs in the trash. The fact it's used for INF just proves it. It's like Maxim got infected with a strain of AIDS. And lensflare. No offense to the creator, it's an admirable effort, but just... just no. No.
So the Maxim effect sucks because it looks like an effect used in Inferno Alliance? This has to be one of the dumbest arguments I've ever heard (that goes for Trashman too). And the Penny Arcade comic isn't helping you. In fact, it's the worst Penny Arcade comic I've ever seen. It's a putrid comedy boil overflowing with unfunny pus. What do you people have against Inferno anyway? I never said it was canon or related to canon or official or anything.
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Fine, I'll justify it: it's a dumb-looking effect, and is un-FreeSpacey. I don't feel that "FreeSpacey" should change because of something a mod of it did. FreeSpace doesn't have to keep up with Inferno, because Inferno is set after FreeSpace anyway. Furthermore, it didn't make sense having this sort of weapon have that effect in the first place.
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Honestly the ring effect has no visual appeal to me at all.
It just looks annoying.
The effect is otherwise pretty good
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Yeah, the one with the rings isn't a bad, as long as you remove the rings (in fact, I am using it without the rings)
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Fine, I'll justify it: it's a dumb-looking effect, and is un-FreeSpacey. I don't feel that "FreeSpacey" should change because of something a mod of it did. FreeSpace doesn't have to keep up with Inferno, because Inferno is set after FreeSpace anyway. Furthermore, it didn't make sense having this sort of weapon have that effect in the first place.
If you want to bandy about timelines, that effect is inspired by Inferno: Alliance, which takes place in between FS1 and FS2. And I don't find it "un-FreeSpacey" at all. I never said FS2 was bound to Inferno in any way, please stop implying that.
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Whatever the Maxim is, it isn't a Railgun.
I would personally hold to the belief that it is a coilgun.
This is about the effects however, not how the fracking thing functions. The Rings make it look ugly. The thing in the middle of the rings actually looks good. I would say, even better than the other one that looks like a fat pill.
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Ok ok... I'll work on the Circe...
I've already worked on the Maxim.
(http://i7.tinypic.com/80noqj9.jpg)
This is the awesome. So awesome unwell grammar is well.
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The problem with adding the rings can be summed up in one word:
"Jetsons"
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No rings should be added. When rings are added to weapons however. They should be made a lot more subtle than what was in the screenshots for the proposed maxim with rings. Another thing is that the quake 2 railgun has a spiral and not rings.
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The problem with adding the rings can be summed up in one word:
"Jetsons"
The wife and daughter are hot, what's your problem :p
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The wife and daughter are hot, what's your problem :p
Cartoon fetishism :yes:
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Why do railguns have to have rings? You can't even see the railgun rounds when they're fired. Or at least that's how it is in RL.
I blame this :p
(http://www.musashionline.com/graphics/railgun.jpg)
I know I'm going to sound like an idiot here but now did you get a non-pixleated energy coil like that?
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:wtf: lolwhut? :wtf:
I don't think the guy who posted this took the screenshot...
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That's a really nice affect for quake 2
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Whether it was done by the person who posted the screenshot or not, I want to know why it looks the way it does there instead of a punch of pixles.
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Perhaps it was a user mod or something, i don't remember there ever being a quake 2 high quality pack being released (their might be one).
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It's Quake II Evolved, a source port for Quake II, or a similar one. Q2E has normal maps, materials, hi-res textures, per-pixel lighting, etc. in newer versions.
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I should get it considering i have quake 2 and it's expansion packs. You gave me another excuse to play the classic again.
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It has bugs and takes some setting up and download hunting, much like FS2_Open a couple of years ago.
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Whatever it is, I want it. :lol:
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****i
Ok ok... I'll work on the Circe...
I've already worked on the Maxim.
(http://i7.tinypic.com/80noqj9.jpg)
This is the awesome. So awesome unwell grammar is well.
****in' awesome.
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:necro:
Another needless necro :rolleyes:
But that Maxim effect does look pretty cool ;7
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But it doesn't look anything like the retail effect. It should be slightly similar at least.
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But it doesn't look anything like the retail effect. It should be slightly similar at least.
Wadaya mean? Blue blob ... cooler looking blue blob.
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Retail = small blue streak
New version = big fat pill-shaped blob
IMO, I liked the one WoolieWool made a whole lot better (without the rings. The rigs made it look bad. the effect without the rings is good).
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Is that the Ripper effect from INFA? (which is in turn from R1)
No-no.
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Make your own ****in' Maxim effects if you don't like the MediaVPs one, or DaBrain's Maxim effects.
Sheesh, it's not THAT hard to do.
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In fact, I am using that Maxim effect, minus the rings.
It actually looks like a mass driver type weapon as opposed to a laser glowing pill.
The effect on that one is fine and all, but the shape is atrocious.
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Yeah...I can't figure out how to replace these effects...
God I haven't been here for a while...
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In fact, I am using that Maxim effect, minus the rings.
It actually looks like a mass driver type weapon as opposed to a laser glowing pill.
Looks like mass driver? Like bullet then?
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Yea...
If the pills get stretched a bit, they would be better that the white-ish streaks, but as they are now, pills = not nice. Glowy, yes, but odd.
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The doctor orders you to take your dosage!!!
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Yea...
If the pills get stretched a bit, they would be better that the white-ish streaks, but as they are now, pills = not nice. Glowy, yes, but odd.
All it takes is one eensy-weensy table edit to expand the effect. Surely you can do that?
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Yea, but as-is I don't see what they're hyped to be.
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I want the pre-original back... the Maxim effect from the FS2 demo: a purplish-blue diagonal line. Make it, make it now!
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Is that the Ripper effect from INFA? (which is in turn from R1)
No-no.
Mine, no, it's a hybridization of the INF:A railguns and the machineguns from TVWP.
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Ah, so the base particle (not the rings) IS meant to be a mass driver (machine gun)
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The original TVWP machine gun bullet is yellow, I changed it to blue to reflect a electrodynamic (railgun or coilgun) weapon.
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That makes perfect sense, because everyone knows caseless uranium slugs are BLUE!
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Maybe they're blue tracers! On every single round!
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That makes perfect sense, because everyone knows caseless uranium slugs are BLUE!
Yes, and everyone knows that fighters run on an inexhaustible supply of magical pixie dust™ and that laz0rz are visible and slow and that massive beamz of death come out of tiny holes in the hull of a ship...
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That makes perfect sense, because everyone knows caseless uranium slugs are BLUE!
Yes, and everyone knows that fighters run on an inexhaustible supply of magical pixie dust™ and that laz0rz are visible and slow and that massive beamz of death come out of tiny holes in the hull of a ship...
Or in the Hecate's and Colly's cases, giant holes discs!
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Somehow ML-16 Lasers travel at less than the speed of light, too, but we'd have to turn the ML-16 into a beam cannon if we really wanted to fix that. That would be rather interesting in FSPort... :P
Correct me if I'm wrong but can't we just design new weapon effects as individual packs to be dropped into the FS2 folders so that we let the user have control (by picking and choosing individual weapon themes) over what their FS2 looks like, without delving into VP modification tools?
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The unfailable beam: a laser firing 100 rounds+ per second, fast speed, 100% or near accurate.
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The ml-16 shooting really fast would make a really cool fighter mounted streaming that could be considered a beam. Since ml-16 is only good against hulls. It'd still be fun to use against cruiser and shield damaged fighters.
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Cardinal Spear's Neutron Flux Cannon is a lot like that. You should try it.
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I tried that one. It's like shooting the lasers on the E-Wing in rapid fire mode in Rogue Squadron 3D, except they just run you out of juice fast rather than overheading. I think just for the hell of it once I tried redirecting all my energy to the guns and that weapon STILL sapped the gun energy dry within a few seconds.
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That makes perfect sense, because everyone knows caseless uranium slugs are BLUE!
Well, the Maxim was blue, so blue must be associated with that kind of weapon in FS.
Besides yellow looks too normal, and too much like the Avenger.
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I've had an idea about the maxim.
First the fluff
Ammunition supplied weapons are dangerous in a space fight as a stray shot can cause the ammunition to explode destroying the fighter when otherwise it's armour and multiple-redundant systems would have allowed it to survive. The avenger avoided this by having a long ammunition feed belt from stores in the core of the fight, but fighters then had to have the space for these even when purely armed with energy weapons. The Maxim takes a new approach to this by using a highly stable propellant block which will only explode when a large amount of electricity is arced through it (this is what causes the energy drain). Apart from it's very distinctive size and shape, the maxim shell looks like a standard APDS round (remember, the maxim is a smoothbore cannon). the firring operation is as follows:
shell is pushed from ammunition hopper into firing chamber.
An electric arc is struck from the shell to the rear of the gun barrell causing the propellant to react and produce the pressure to accelerate the shell along the barrel of the gun.
the electric arc conitues to be struck across the propellant block as the amount of gas produced is very high and so if the block all reacted to start with the breech would be blown off th gun.
Projectile emerges from front of barrel at high velocity, friction with the bore having cased the Sabots to start vapourising.
When the projectile hits the target it's kinetic energy combined with careful desing of the armour peircing cap allow for more damage the would be expected from just impact with the relatively slow projectile.
OK for what the projectile would look like.
The armour-piercing core is a complex-shaped, multi-alloy spike, around 10cm long and 2 in diemeter, with 2 sabots, one near the tip, and the other at the base (this would, before firing be in contact with the propellant block).
In-game this would apear as a darkgrey dark with two glowing blue bands around it (the glow is due to the high temperature in the sabots). If a more complex effect is desired, there could be particles coming off the sabots as they disintegrate, or a glowing (white or red) base to the dart where the arc was struck from. finally, the ultimae variant would be animated with the animate times to last the liftime of the projectile and slowly showing the sabots disappearing as they disintegrate and boil off, and the glowing base cool.
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Meh, my complaint about the Maxim is pretty simple. It's called the "Freespace Upgrade" project not the "FreeSpace Change the Effect to what I think it should look like instead" project. New effects should be largely revamps of the the original, not something else entirely.
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And this is an upgrade OMG :eek: It actually looks like the maxim puts out projectiles now :eek: And this actually fits the maxim tech description too :eek: It is similarly colored to the old one :eek: (the original was more white)
Old maxim looked like a ****ty low quality laser which didn't fit the tech description. The visuals for the original maxim were very uninspired for a very V creatively inspired idea of the maxim.
In this case getting a completely different affect is understandable. The original maxim affect was ****, so is the one currently in the mvp's that currently replaces the original affect. This one needs to get put in. :yes:
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And this is an upgrade OMG :eek: It actually looks like the maxim puts out projectiles now :eek: And this actually fits the maxim tech description too :eek: It is similarly colored to the old one :eek: (the original was more white)
Old maxim looked like a ****ty low quality laser which didn't fit the tech description. The visuals for the original maxim were very uninspired for a very V creatively inspired idea of the maxim.
In this case getting a completely different affect is understandable. The original maxim affect was ****, so is the one currently in the mvp's that currently replaces the original affect. This one needs to get put in. :yes:
Whether you liked the old Maxim's effects or not it's what volition put in the game. I don't know if the FSU project maxim has been upgraded since what I last saw, but the last thing I did see was some dinky blue or white little bullet coming out of my plane. Basically something which looked nothing like the old effect whatsoever. The old effect, might've looked like a "****ty laser" to some but for my part it was a huge glowing blast of destruction which rocked my plane with every round I fired.
The Mentu doesn't fit the tech description either, but was the ship table changed to include Beams as default?? NO.
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Well, V still didn't do a good job making the original affects for the maxim while the idea for the maxim was great. Now other weapons in the game are getting an overhaul as well. Shivan bombs and shivan flak to name a few. Because shivan bombs should look like shivan bombs and not the same damn cyclops torpedoes that terrans use. And shivan flak projectiles and perhaps even flak explosions shouldn't look the same as TV flak. Making the maxim less ****ty is part of the same bandwagon getting rid of inconsistencies :yes:
You're mentu example is a big cop out. The mentu doesn't fit it's tech description like the maxim doesn't fit it's own. They just don't fit their tech descriptions in different ways. The mentu has no anticap beams while the original maxim looks like a ****ing laser gun. The mentu problem can't be fixed, someone would have to add beam turrets onto a mentu. This would be worthless as those beam turrets would never get used, as well as pointless.
The maxim affect can be fixed and is not worthless or pointless.
The old effect, might've looked like a "****ty laser" to some but for my part it was a huge glowing blast of destruction which rocked my plane with every round I fired.
Don't use the mvp's or realize the similarities from this maxim upgrade to the original. I've already pointed out a bunch of those in my last post. The last thing is try using the new affect. The creator of it says it looks massively cooler in gameplay as opposed to a projectile screenshot where it is spitting out a huge glowing blast of destruction which still rocks your fighter (again look for similarites, it's not wierd for me to point them out, but it's wierd when you point out similarities that the old and new affects have in common....in fact we both know they have a lot in common...i thought you didn't like this new affect, but clearly you do :yes:).
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We talking about the same effect here???
Screen attached, of the old in the bottom corner and the new BB gun Maxim front and centre. Though oddly enough I don't remember the Maxim being jagged like that at all . . .
EDIT - oops, can't really see the new worth **** but it's basically just some little BB pellet with some whiteish haze around it. Wholly unsatisfying to fire for me at least.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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When you mean old? Do you mean the retail maxim affect? And when you mean new do you mean the new affect without the rings that was made in this thread?
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IMO the old effect was better... :wtf:
BTW, do you have a tablet?
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It's called the "Freespace Upgrade" project not the "FreeSpace Change the Effect to what I think it should look like instead" project. New effects should be largely revamps of the the original, not something else entirely.
I have not been following this thread closely, but this needs a big QFT. The media VPs are not the place to make wholesale stylistic changes as people see fit.
Also, to whoever said "just edit the tbm if you don't like the new one," it's not that simple. This is the first media VP package that will be used in multiplayer and the central server will immediately reject any such changes it detects.
In this case getting a completely different affect is understandable. The original maxim affect was ****, so is the one currently in the mvp's that currently replaces the original affect. This one needs to get put in.
Of course, this is only your opinion. Many of us like the original effect. I haven't yet seen the new ones posted here in the game (where they may look quite different), but any substantially different concept for this belongs in a mod and not the media VPs.
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We talking about the same effect here???
Screen attached, of the old in the bottom corner and the new BB gun Maxim front and centre. Though oddly enough I don't remember the Maxim being jagged like that at all . . .
EDIT - oops, can't really see the new worth **** but it's basically just some little BB pellet with some whiteish haze around it. Wholly unsatisfying to fire for me at least.
The bb gun affect you posted is the maxim affect that's currently in the mvp's. I already talked about that one reread a last post by me or something. I was pretty descriptive about retail old and the old one that's in the mvp's...in a wierd way. I can do better. Here's the screenshot to the new one in this thread that was on like page 5. I figured that when i'm talking about the new affect, that people would understand that i meant the one in this thread that was created.
(http://i7.tinypic.com/80noqj9.jpg)
This is no bb gun o doom. This is is also similar to the original.
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You know, you could have just complained that the size of the shot was too small. That's all your complaint really is. That's not that hard to resolve.
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This is no bb gun o doom. This is is also similar to the original.
Yeah, its not BB gun. Its a pill launcher, to make sure those kids who won't take their meds do so.
The only similarity with the original is that they're blue...and glowy.
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You know, you could have just complained that the size of the shot was too small. That's all your complaint really is. That's not that hard to resolve.
No, that's not really my complaint. If it were bigger, it would just be a big white ball instead of a small white ball. Whereas the original retail effect looked more akin to an energy blast, which, while perhaps in some interpretations is contrary to the tech description it is what is.
The bb gun affect you posted is the maxim affect that's currently in the mvp's. I already talked about that one reread a last post by me or something. I was pretty descriptive about retail old and the old one that's in the mvp's...in a wierd way. I can do better. Here's the screenshot to the new one in this thread that was on like page 5. I figured that when i'm talking about the new affect, that people would understand that i meant the one in this thread that was created.
That looks better though it's hard to know how it looks exactly when they're seemingly fired from another craft rather than the players craft (which is what people will be seeing 95% of the time).
IMO the old effect was better... :wtf:
BTW, do you have a tablet?
Yeah, waccom Tablet. Not a Cintiq.
Tablet only runs about 150 CDN.
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Meh, my complaint about the Maxim is pretty simple. It's called the "Freespace Upgrade" project not the "FreeSpace Change the Effect to what I think it should look like instead" project. New effects should be largely revamps of the the original, not something else entirely.
Agreed. The Media VPs reflect the FreeSpace Upgrade Project and the VPs have been featuring unwanted extras, things that are not so much upgrades but are eye candy modifications that rightfully belong under FreeSpace Modding.
We need a system to enable safe eyecandy modifications without multiplayer cheat problems.
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Generalised sentiments of "There's stuff in the MVPs that shouldn't be official" are completely and utterly useless to us, so how 'bout this:
Could everyone who has a gripe about something currently in the 3.6.10 beta MVPs please list what those things are either here or in the main thread, so that we can see if any of them are issues we need to address.
Remember that all the past official MVP releases have been assembled by single individuals - and even though they've done a brilliant job each time, the fiddly nature and shear amount of content that needs to be managed makes it very very tricky to get it right first time. Now that we have a management team it should be a lot easier.
Also, keep in mind that gripes like 'the HTL model X looks too different - it shouldn't be considered official' will probably not be acted upon, considering how few and far between HTL modellers are nowadays. :p
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I'll be the first to officially note that the Maxim effect is underwhelming and has deviated too far from the retail effect.
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I know HTL models are rare, but the HTL Typhon is a) crap and b) has more than the normal amount of turrets.
I mean the original Typhon model looked way better. :rolleyes:
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There's an HP Typhon? :nervous:
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Yeah, it should be on fsmods. It is not a great htl model; it doesn't have a lot more detail than the original and it is still tile-mapped, but I disagree with Snail - I think it is better than the original. There is also the problem, as Snail mentioned, of it having more turrets than the original, but its pretty easy to ignore that or if you can't its a 5 minute job to delete the new turrets in PCS2.
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Well if you looks at the example of the SD Lucifer, people overlooked the extra turrets because
a) You could simply not activate them
b) It was a damn good model
I'm assuming neither applies here?
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a) You could simply not activate them
You could.
b) It was a damn good model
It wasn't.
My main gripe about the HTL Typhon is that most of its polies were used to make it smoother. That did little to make it look better, the original's lighting was fine and everything. The HTL version also had the stupid fighterbays where fighters appear out of nowhere and were just a ****ing wall (like the Ravana and Hatshepsut's) while the original typhon had a much more detailed and logical fighterbay where fighters actually exited from them instead of just appearing. Lots of the nice little ship-specific texture touches Volition made to the original model were also lost, which I didn't like either. To round it all off, it used more textures and so used up more memory.
It was crap, really.
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the circe is fuzzy and pathetic
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The HTL version also had the stupid fighterbays where fighters appear out of nowhere and were just a ****ing wall (like the Ravana and Hatshepsut's) while the original typhon had a much more detailed and logical fighterbay where fighters actually exited from them instead of just appearing.
Can't argue with that.
To round it all off, it used more textures and so used up more memory.
Or that...
Lots of the nice little ship-specific texture touches Volition made to the original model were also lost, which I didn't like either.
Care to elaborate?
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Okay, take capital04-05a as a texture for example. See where the Sensor subsystem is, with the thing with the horns? On Volition's model, it is tiled in such a way that it is a unique pattern not seen anywhere else on the ship. On TrashMan's it is tiled over 4 times.
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Point taken.
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yeah that one could be better.
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TrashMan's Orion was decent enough but his Typhon wasn't really that good IMO.
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Good god this thread isn't dead yet? :shaking:
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Hmm... Let's see why... Because you bumped it back to the top? :P