[Mefustae]

Also do we have in fs a ship that is the equivalent of of an attack submarine or a balistic submarine. a ship that can actualy lay low undetected then storm out fire a couple of heliosses or  beams or something like that take out the enemy warship then make a speaddy exit?

Such a ship wouldnt actualy be involved in the kind of fighting we normaly see cuz it would get thorn to shreads really fast.

The idea has been kicked around for years, and comes up from time to time in discussion, but I believe nothing has really come of it. That should be a rather glaring indication of the amount of interest in such an idea right there.

[NGTM-1R]

The idea has been kicked around for years, and comes up from time to time in discussion, but I believe nothing has really come of it. That should be a rather glaring indication of the amount of interest in such an idea right there.

Beg differ, though still a WIP.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v307/ngtm1r/Hornet.jpg

[AlphaOne]

er....do u have some other picture of it cuz well its kidn of dark !

I magine such a ship at about 800 metters in leght and having say 2 powerfull beam cannons and a couple or burst torpedo/bomb launchers. this wai it would emerge realli fast open fire on the ship at hand and inflict a verry good damage then move out of the area fast!

[aldo_14]

Also do we have in fs a ship that is the equivalent of of an attack submarine or a balistic submarine. a ship that can actualy lay low undetected then storm out fire a couple of heliosses or  beams or something like that take out the enemy warship then make a speaddy exit?

Such a ship wouldnt actualy be involved in the kind of fighting we normaly see cuz it would get thorn to shreads really fast.

The idea has been kicked around for years, and comes up from time to time in discussion, but I believe nothing has really come of it. That should be a rather glaring indication of the amount of interest in such an idea right there.

Both Bobbauauauauauoaua and I have made subspace 'submarine' type cruisers.  However, it's worth noting there's no such thing as a one-hit-kill weapon you can mount on a ship in FS2, especially not for something GTVA and small.

[AlphaOne]

i didnt say one say it had to be one-hit-kill but rather something that can come in reasonably fast fire its weapons at the target do a reasonable amount of damage then duck out fast. I mean they would be idael fo harrasing the enemy and if you couple 3 or 4 of these things i would imagine no ship out there would be safe. kinda like the wolfpacks used by Doenitz during wwII.

Its just and idea .

[aldo_14]

i didnt say one say it had to be one-hit-kill but rather something that can come in reasonably fast fire its weapons at the target do a reasonable amount of damage then duck out fast. I mean they would be idael fo harrasing the enemy and if you couple 3 or 4 of these things i would imagine no ship out there would be safe. kinda like the wolfpacks used by Doenitz during wwII.

Its just and idea .

The problem is that hit-and-run isn't massively useful in a situation where ships can jump vast distances instaneously; in WW2 convoys had to travel slowly, in FS2 they pop in and out of realspace.  The latter makes it a lot more difficult to use this type of attack effectively.

[Colonol Dekker]

With regards to the weapons comments earlier, Surely the cost of building a pack of smaller "beefy" ships (im not prepared to use the word deadly) could be used to equip/buil;d one (or more) larger ships with the same weapon (it was meant to be torps or meaty beams IIRC?) Cost wise argument= reactor costs, crew costs, and time spent directing logistacally, tracking and organisation as a whole would be a lot cheaper. IMHO. But i suppose Autonomy could be given.... But autonomy comes without support to extents, supplies etc. In closing "Meh" 

[Mefustae]

Beg differ, though still a WIP.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v307/ngtm1r/Hornet.jpg

Both Bobbauauauauauoaua and I have made subspace 'submarine' type cruisers.  However, it's worth noting there's no such thing as a one-hit-kill weapon you can mount on a ship in FS2, especially not for something GTVA and small.

I stand corrected.

[AlphaOne]

With regards to the weapons comments earlier, Surely the cost of building a pack of smaller "beefy" ships (im not prepared to use the word deadly) could be used to equip/buil;d one (or more) larger ships with the same weapon (it was meant to be torps or meaty beams IIRC?) Cost wise argument= reactor costs, crew costs, and time spent directing logistacally, tracking and organisation as a whole would be a lot cheaper. IMHO. But i suppose Autonomy could be given.... But autonomy comes without support to extents, supplies etc. In closing "Meh" 

Say what? do u mean to tell me that a bigger ship with the sme weapons is actualy cheaper to operate and maintain then a smaller one?? well then why the hell dont we just get ridd of all the corvettes and destroyers and start building juggs....cuz its cheaper to run and operate...

that is if i understud you right!

[Colonol Dekker]

You obviously dont then 

The speculated HK ship you mentioned if operating solo, by no means would be more expensive build cost wise. But a pack of ships 3 to 4 i'd imagine is similar to WW2 submarine SOP.  We have corvettes already for smacky smack big ships,

I magine such a ship at about 800 metters in leght and having say 2 powerfull beam cannons and a couple or burst torpedo/bomb launchers. this wai it would emerge realli fast open fire on the ship at hand and inflict a verry good damage then move out of the area fast

Surely a demios (its about the right size) two beams, and no-one says it cant jump out if its getting battered. would fill this role.

Say what? do u mean to tell me that a bigger ship with the sme weapons is actualy cheaper to operate and maintain then a smaller one?? well then why the hell dont we just get ridd of all the corvettes and destroyers and start building juggs....cuz its cheaper to run and operate...

Simple fleasibility, Its a fine scale, same reason there isnt just a single ship displacing 30-millin tonnes parked in the atlantic replacing the US navy, cos it would be stupid
The  GTVA already have ships as you described, They're called corvettes,  If you want strike attacks use STRIKE bombers. Or a Fenris cruiser.

I aint arguing, just having my say.

[AlphaOne]

umm you have a point only a corvette is about 1 km in leght if i'm not mistaken again.(wouldnt be the first time).
Also I somehow doubght a slasher beam has nearly enough power to do significant damage to a cap ship. I was thinking something smaller then a corvette a little sleaker looking, not that the deimos isnt sleek or anithing, and posibly give it 2 BG and a couple of torpedo/bomb launchers. Also it would have to be somewhat faster and more manouverable then a corvette. Not in a ridiculous kind of way! Or even one BG and 2 slashers would be good along with the bombs and all.

But to achieve a little better speed and manouverabylaty it would have to sacrifice some armour that is why i said it wouldnt actualy be able to survive an actual cap ship fight at least not for long. This would the kind of ship which is best described by the fraze "shoot first ask questions later and then get the hell out of the firing range"

[Colonol Dekker]

Christ and hunter man!, First dont act so belligerent,.

A corvette may well be a Kilometer in length, to be honest i dont know, care, not that you spelt length correctly in the first place, What am i meant to do, guess what you mean to say, use my non-exisistant psychic powers to bridge the gap between myself and frickin romania to comprehend you lacklustre grasp of english? second you didnt say i want a ship precisely 800M in length, you said about 800m in length, Now in my eys a Corvett is the closest to that size , Dont qoute me, I dont know!

Thirdly, The Iceni, Can already do what you Say its cot non-slash beams as well, I just didnt mention it cos it contradicts your size laws.. Alphaone, grammar... all i have to say grammar.

[AlphaOne]

Yes i know mi grammar is horrible. Also mi english speaking is a lot better then mi spelling. So it still better then nothing. Also a reason for mi horible spelling is actualy mi fast tiping well sort of fast. Usualy when i'm posting i'm at work and have to speed up the tiping process at the cost of spelling acuracy. Also the Iceny has too much firepower for what I sugested. I mean that thing has almost the same firepower as an Orion which is the most heavely armed destroyer the GTVA has.

Also I imagined something a bit smaller then that, actualy a bit smaller then a Corvette.
At about 800 m. Could be 820 or 870 i dont really care but it definetly needs to be smaller then a corvette.(Actualy you go down to 700+ metters to about 800)

the point is it has to have at least one powerfull beam preferably a BFG or 2 BG or could even use vasudan beams for that matter on the count of faster recharge rate. And at least 4 bomb/torpedo launchers. This would enable it to come in fast fire a salvo of beams and a salvo of bommbs, posibly as soon as it exits subspace in case it jumps close enough,(although i would imagine it would actualy have to aquire lock on its target) and then jump out or stay for a second salvo of beams if the situation permits it.

this would enable it to take out a corvette and cause serious damage to a destroyer. Especialy if its a Hecate cuz well the Hecate has only shashers on its sides.

The fighter cover would be a problem because they would manage to take down the bombs but then agin they cant do much against a surpise atack of beams.

Its just an idea also a i wasnt tryng to act belligerent. Sorry!

[Colonol Dekker]

No harm done, i'm at work myself. apology accepted.
You've made sound suggestions and points.

[TrashMan]

Hm...the cost effectiveness of ships depends on may factors - one of them being the enemy youre fighting.

A fleet of smaller ships is good for covering a larger area and against SOME larger ships.

A big supership on the other hand has the advantage of surviving where smalelr ships couldn't...

It al ldepends in hte end..

[AlphaOne]

Well its like this the mai use of these ships would be to take out shivan capships. they would come in fast in pairs say 2 or 3 of them, acting on recon intel regarding the enemy ships position do they best not the enter the forward firing ark...then open fire on the enemy ship really fast...! and because we all know that shivan cap ships have crappy aaaf defenses they can get rind of a full voley of helioss without a problem. Thus taking out the main threat then bugging out. This way no big ship deployment no fuss regarding boombers and fighter escorts. Also you could even give them adequate fighter defences not to strong though. And why not they could even be very usefull against GTVA warships.

but I bet that if the current configuration is set up properly a reasonable number of these ships could come in get a hit or 2 at the sathanas then bug out before theyre swarmed by fighters and bommbers. On the other hand if they hit the fighter bay on the first run you would be home free to do cercle around the blasted thing. I doubght even a jug has the hull strenght to resiste 5 or 6 of these ships opening fire on it with 2 or 3 beams each. thats what 12-18 beams firing on the blasted thing. and even if it bugs out fast i doubght it can bug out fast enough to avoid a salvo from the ships. (under 4 seconds that is)

[aldo_14]

And what if the Shivans use their recon to destroy these ships before they can get near any Shivan vessel?

[AlphaOne]

How? These ships are suposed to stay low hide or somethin like that then jump in fast take the shot then bug out if they have to. Also i suspect that the GTVA would asign a couple of fighter wings to keep the shivan sighter wings ocupied and distracted..!

That's like saing i cant cross the street when the light is green for pedestrians cuz i might get hit by a bad driver or something like that.

There would be calcutaed risks!

[Ghostavo]

How? These ships are suposed to stay low hide or somethin like that then jump in fast take the shot then bug out if they have to. Also i suspect that the GTVA would asign a couple of fighter wings to keep the shivan sighter wings ocupied and distracted..!

That's like saing i cant cross the street when the light is green for pedestrians cuz i might get hit by a bad driver or something like that.

There would be calcutaed risks!

Is it even possible to lay low and hide from the Shivans? These things could detect ships in the nebula with ease while the GTVA was mearly stabbing in the dark trying to see what was out there.

[aldo_14]

How? These ships are suposed to stay low hide or somethin like that then jump in fast take the shot then bug out if they have to. Also i suspect that the GTVA would asign a couple of fighter wings to keep the shivan sighter wings ocupied and distracted..!

That's like saing i cant cross the street when the light is green for pedestrians cuz i might get hit by a bad driver or something like that.

There would be calcutaed risks!

And why wouldn't the Shivans themselves (ignoring their tremendous subspace ability and thus likely detection of enemy travel) lay low from detection the minute they discover this GTVA tactic?