[aldo_14]

Okay, makes sense

I think the largest Terran population outside of Sol is Delta Serpentis, it's right next to Sol, and was the capital of the GTA after the Sol node colapsed.

Yeah, although... don't know how habitable it is.  It could be a symbolic capital due to proximity or military presence rather than population.  There's a mention, I think, that a lot of the map 'north' of DS was unexplored in FS1 times (well, Laramis, which to me indicates a fair chunk), though, which perhaps points to a concentrated population in the likes of DS, BA and Ross 128.

[Mars]

You mean South

Alpha Centuri would have the largest symbolic impact in that case.

[StratComm]

But Alpha Centauri is Vasudan.

[Mars]

I know, but it is still the closest system to Earth.

[Sarafan]

The main systems of GTVA (higher population, industrial capacity, military importance, etc), in my estimative, would be:

Delta Serpentis, Deneb, Sirius, Beta Aquilae, Antares, Ribos, Alpha Centauri, Vasuda, Vega, Beta Cignny, Polaris and Regulus.

Also the GTVA would have a population in order of several billions somewhat evenly spread amog these and to a lesser extent other systems like Laramis.

[Mars]

All of the systems beyond Laramis (so Luyten 726-BA, Bernard's Star, Wolf 359 (described by debreifing as being remote, and possessing the 12^th fleet), Alphard, and Dubhe, and the semi-canon unknown system(s) beyond Dubhe, are the frontier of the Terrans.

[AlphaOne]

Umm well we do know that the Vasudans actualy lost only Theyr Homeworld. Also it was said somewheer that they dont colonize that many planets but rather when they set up a colony they tend to stai there untill that coloni reaches its limit in terms of population support then go around looking for a new place where they can establish yet another colony.

Also Capella is a rtaher long way away from the GTVA core sistems so I guess its pulation while dense and rather large is still only a small percentage of its actual population. (of the GTVA that is).

I wonder if the GTVA actualy has something like modern day cruise liners that carry people from one place to another. Or in times of war strip them aout and double or even tripple theyr loeading capacity.

There was this one case when a german pasanger ship ment to take on some 200-300 people actualy took on boar more then 800.

[Wanderer]

Its bit different in space... Life support on normal 'wet navy' ships is relatively simple.. Just some food and water and its done. However in space life support also has to provide enough air for everybody so taking more onboard than what the life support can handle is likely to be a very bad solution. So it isnt as simple (or how do i know) as it is now to convert cargo freighters or cruise liners into troop transports.

[aldo_14]

Umm well we do know that the Vasudans actualy lost only Theyr Homeworld. Also it was said somewheer that they dont colonize that many planets but rather when they set up a colony they tend to stai there untill that coloni reaches its limit in terms of population support then go around looking for a new place where they can establish yet another colony.

Also Capella is a rtaher long way away from the GTVA core sistems so I guess its pulation while dense and rather large is still only a small percentage of its actual population. (of the GTVA that is).

I wonder if the GTVA actualy has something like modern day cruise liners that carry people from one place to another. Or in times of war strip them aout and double or even tripple theyr loeading capacity.

There was this one case when a german pasanger ship ment to take on some 200-300 people actualy took on boar more then 800.

You're making a key mistake here; you're assuming Capella is not densely population due to distance, but ignoring the possibility that it is a far more habitable system than others.  Ultimately, distance from resources will matter more than distance from other systems; Vega might be closer to BA, but if all the planets are blasted hellholes incapable of supporting life without massive investment and if (purely if) Capella was full of lush, green, inhabitable worlds... well, which do you think is more likely to be populated?

To me ' the densely-populated Capella system' in A Flaming Sword makes it pretty clear.

TO CLARIFY; dense can have several meanings, to be fair.  A small population in a smaller space being one.

But, the only meaning that makes sense in this context, to me, is a high population which is difficult to evacuate.  The reason being, this is a military briefing; if it was a small, i.e. trivial, population, there's no need for the dense bit.

[AlphaOne]

umm i thought something like that would be the answer. This sucks...I mean you know you can put more people in one ship the space alows you to but the Life support sistems dont cut it. Well they can alwasy hold theyr breath.

umm i never said it wouldnt be desly populated I just wanted to say that its not as populated as it could of been should it of been more close to the core sistems. Also was capella around in FS1 I mean was it discovered or colonized??

[aldo_14]

umm i never said it wouldnt be desly populated I just wanted to say that its not as populated as it could of been should it of been more close to the core sistems. Also was capella around in FS1 I mean was it discovered or colonized??

I corrected my usage of 'densely' above to clarify it.  It's not clear whether Capella was colonised in FS1 era or not; it seems quite unlikely due to probable fighting in Vega.  However, looking at the likes of Regulus and Polaris, which are arguably (as NTF base-systems) predominantly Terran, it's hard to judge colonisation times or otherwise.  We do, at least, know that Laramis was only explored during the Great War, which makes colonisation of the systems off of it less likely; it also indicates that none of the systems like DS, Ross 128, etc were overpopulated (although this is a rather relative concept in itself).

In any case, to evaluate the likely population of the GTVA you have to guess a) how many people likely emigrated from Vasuda Prime and Sol prior to their being cut off, b) what the reproductive rates were in the 30-odd years since then (and on top of post-emigration rates), and c) how many died as a result of the 2 Shivan wars, the TV War, and the NTF genocide.  To determine likely distribution is somewhat tougher; firstly, naturally habitable (i.e. supporting large populations without extensive terraforming or domed colonies and exterior reliance) planets are believed very rare in actuality.  Secondly, and annoyingly, I don't think FS2 systems bear any resemblance to reality, so we probably can't use actual stars to guess at likely habitability.

[AlphaOne]

No arguement from me there! 

I was just on about the fact that the Vasudans actualy had very few colonies established as oposed to their numbers. I believe it was on the VBB that it was said that the vasudans tend to actualy not go too far from their homeworld. This could actualy sugest a rather large population in the sistems that are actualy under vasudan control or rather in the sistems where the vasudans established colonies.

Also I would imagine that given the fact the Sol can only provide habbitable place for only limited amount of people the star sistems that can actuali support life would be very densly populated. Meaning planets from DS and others like it . Basicly the star sistems that were first colonized.

[aldo_14]

If anything, the Vasudans are more likely to have colonies than the Terrans......

Also, how do you know the first colonized systems, and how do you know they were the most habitable rather than, well, the first?

[AlphaOne]

umm actualy i dont! I was just asuming that with early tech the colonization of other planets wouldnt be as easy as with current tech!

[Colonol Dekker]

The vasudans intel says that the little buggers developed spaceflight to colonise other planets, But as to whether that was before Uber humanity got around to it, Thats another matter.
Discussion point...>>

Do you reckon the vasudans met us on our turf, or vice-versa, Cos tha would go a little way towards showing who was more outgoing in some slight way i assume.

[aldo_14]

umm actualy i dont! I was just asuming that with early tech the colonization of other planets wouldnt be as easy as with current tech!

I'm sorry, you'll have to explain what your point it here, because I don't get it.

[AlphaOne]

Well it wasnt suposed to be a point there it was just an asumption that the first stages of the expansion for both the terrans and vasudans wasnt that extensive I mean posibly just in the neighboring starsistem. If subspace tech was in its infanci then it would of benn posibly harder for them to move over great leghts. That is if there were such problems in the begining. But even if there were no such problems with engines with ship size there suer was. So no large scale expansion in the begining I guess with only one posibly 2 starsistem beeing colonized and posibly becoming densly populated over time.

Umm dont know exactly what tipe of engines thy had in the begining but rest asured that they were not capable of traveling outside of theyr sistems. Also I beleive there is a paragraph somewhere that sais that the GTA was unable to overcome to dificulties of faster then light travel.


This would sugest that they migh of come close to the speed of light or even managed to get at ligh speed travel. But it was unusable outside of theyr own sistem. So they were esenciali trapped till the discovery of subspace.


From what I know the Terrans migh of stumbeled across the vasudans. And with bad language they eventualy started blasting the hell out of eachother.

[Mars]

It was different from the Terrans to Vasudans. The Terrans probably started by colonizing planets in their solar system, whereas Vasuda Prime is the only planet is Vasuda capable of supporting life, so they probably would have started out with orbital stations.

[AlphaOne]

Umm that raises a whole new question about the time they actuly developed subspace drives!

[Mars]

It says when the Terrams discovered subspace somwhere, I think in one of the cancelled cutscenes, but I don't know where the scripts are anymore.