Author Topic: renegade capital ships info  (Read 9119 times)

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Offline starlord

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renegade capital ships info
Hi, I'm starlord.

This is a plea to all renegade legion fans out there (there must still be some). I am trying to finish the story of the renegade legion universe and for that I need all info on the renegade (and TOG) capital ships.

Please help me so the project can continue. The story must be finished.

advice awaited eagerly.

best regards.

mike.

 
Re: renegade capital ships info
I'd help, but I have no knowledge of the game and there's little info about it. Sorry
That's cool and ....disturbing at the same time o_o  - Vasudan Admiral

"Don't play games with me. You just killed someone I like, that is not a safe place to stand. I'm the Doctor. And you're in the biggest library in the universe. Look me up."

"Quick everyone out of the universe now!"

 

Offline Flipside

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Re: renegade capital ships info
Moved to gaming, you're more likely to get a response there.

Good luck :)

 

Offline starlord

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Re: renegade capital ships info
Thanks: I think I found some renegades in the battletech series. :nod:
I desperately need those ships, which reminds me: you'll go haywire when you see them: they are uniquely beautiful and it's a crime not to have included them in more renegades space combat games (like jacob's star).

 

Offline Inquisitor

Re: renegade capital ships info
Isn't this a board game?
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Offline starlord

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Re: renegade capital ships info
Yup! but a space combat game called battle for jacob's star was spawned out of this universe and I think it's great.

And I would like to see one day the story end.

Great leap today, I didn't find everything yet, but you can see the cap ships there (most of them, that is, as new designs like the seneca are still missing).

http://members.tripod.com/~Cwintel/leviathan.pdf (page 45 to 56).

And the interceptors are there: http://www.the-underdogs.info/games/r/renegade/files/renegade-ships.zip

please look at those ships, they rock! what would you think of flying a fighter against those leviathans? ;7

so long.

 

Offline Inquisitor

Re: renegade capital ships info
I think I have the board game or at least something related to it in my collection at home, I'll have a look.
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Offline gevatter Lars

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Re: renegade capital ships info
Indeed there are some interesting designs.
"Yes! That is my plan, and I see nothing wrong with it. I figure that if I stick to a stupid strategy long enough it might start to work."
 - comment to "Robotech: The Masters"

 

Offline starlord

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Re: renegade capital ships info
It would be a crime not to include those beauties in a freespace MOD. This is why I'm going to get working on refurbishing a story for it (it's going along great).

lars: did you see the shiva and syracuse? Those are my favourites, although the fulgur is great too, I LOVE the angular fin like designs of the TOG ships. Some of the newest designs are not included like the TOG seneca cruiser (one of my favourites too), I hope that when I have a scanner, I'll be able to scan a picture of it.

 

Offline starlord

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Re: renegade capital ships info
Hey, scooby: With those ship pictures available, could you perhaps help me model them?

 
Re: renegade capital ships info
Ok these do look better than what you sent me earlier.  Theres a few that have caught my eye.  Page 28,  page 30 looks kilrathi-ish, page 36 looks like the dragon, too bad theres only the front pic, can't do much with that, page 54, looks nice, not sure if I can do correctly with two views,  page 58, neat.


Hmmmm now this looks doable:

http://www.nobleknight.com/ProductDetail.asp_Q_ProductID_E_2147350413_A_InventoryID_E_2147512461_A_ProductLineID_E_720_A_ManufacturerID_E_23_A_CategoryID_E_5_A_GenreID_E_

Actually looks a lot like my Stalker bomber.
That's cool and ....disturbing at the same time o_o  - Vasudan Admiral

"Don't play games with me. You just killed someone I like, that is not a safe place to stand. I'm the Doctor. And you're in the biggest library in the universe. Look me up."

"Quick everyone out of the universe now!"

 

Offline gevatter Lars

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Re: renegade capital ships info
The view reminds me a little bit of the Bearcat.

Beside modeling and Storyline...what about the weapons and gameplay? Have you allready some thoughts about that?
From just a quick look at the manual it seams to have basicly two weapon types. Missiles and lasers. Both come in about 100 different variations and seam to be placed in broadside formation/bays for most parts of the ships with some turrets here and there.

So fighters would more likely be there for taking out components of the caps while other capships provide the raw firepower to destroy an enemy capship.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2007, 05:54:40 am by gevatter Lars »
"Yes! That is my plan, and I see nothing wrong with it. I figure that if I stick to a stupid strategy long enough it might start to work."
 - comment to "Robotech: The Masters"

 

Offline starlord

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Re: renegade capital ships info
Hmm, the verutum! :nod:

Am I Right?

for the others, I'd say: 28: cingulum TOG corvette
30: renegade space gull  med fighter
36: front view of a repulse renegade battleship (I think)
54: exeter renegade destroyer
58: pilum TOG med fighter
« Last Edit: November 30, 2007, 06:12:14 am by starlord »

 

Offline gevatter Lars

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Re: renegade capital ships info
Both of these ships (Shiva and Syracruse) are looking nice but I think I would prefere the Repulse or County as designs.
Overall the designs looks sleak and simple compared to most modern Scifi ships.

When just look at the Battletech Warships of the latest books. Man these are much different then the Union or Overlords that I have first seen when I started reading about Battletech.
Something I allways wanted was a Battletech mod in space. Seeing battles between these ships would be awesome. Navel ACs bolds that are ripping appart other ships armor, PPCs lighting up the space and hugh salvos of missiles flying from one ship to the other.....
"Yes! That is my plan, and I see nothing wrong with it. I figure that if I stick to a stupid strategy long enough it might start to work."
 - comment to "Robotech: The Masters"

 
Re: renegade capital ships info
I think it's the verutum :confused:

@lars, it reminds me of the Karnenan (which my stalker was based on)
That's cool and ....disturbing at the same time o_o  - Vasudan Admiral

"Don't play games with me. You just killed someone I like, that is not a safe place to stand. I'm the Doctor. And you're in the biggest library in the universe. Look me up."

"Quick everyone out of the universe now!"

 

Offline starlord

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Re: renegade capital ships info
actually, swarm attacks can prove very effective at destroying capships in renegade, although the precision strikes are enormously important in those cases (destroying the VLCA com antennas or damage guns).

Also, the ships have laser broadsides (turrets), extensive missile batteries AND spinal mount weapons (consider those heavy laser cannons similar to freespace 2's beam cannons) going right aft to stern of the ship), the shiva class even has a special forward one capable of cracking a planet's crust or frying other ships in a single salvo.

My plos would be the following (I'll make it quick).

campaign 1: (picks up just after the renegade: battle for jacob's star plot where supposidely, you defended the jacob's star system in the messana pocket (the band of territory going deep in TOG space in the shannedam county of the alaric grand dukedom:http://members.tripod.com/~Rintel/Data/Campaign3a.htm ). The TOG advance has been badly shaken and the moment for an effective counterattack couldn't have been better. Now that crucible command in jacob's star has been reinforced, It will be our coordinating center. The mission will be to prevent any retaliatory TOG attack on the messana pocket while finding the TOG C and C base in shannedam and destroying it. This should release the grip of the TOG in alaric.

campaign 2: With the destruction of the command TOG base in the remote system of sparta hill, we have confirmation that the TOG is hurting. Similar offensives have been mounted in the birchshire, pembroke, yoventrov and rift counties simultaneously and have left the enemy staggering. However, the analysis of the computer cores of the seneca class TOG cruiser "bane warder"before it's destruction has given us troubling rumours: This cruiser is TOG's cutting edge, available only in small numbers to the "lictor", the TOG's secret bureau, responsible of all covert operations and the information (albeit incomplete) we have extracted from it confirms abnormal enemy activity in the gilpin cosmic west fringe. the only thing we know of this TOG operation is it's codename: "vae victis". You are to depart from our newly established toenails in the rift county, and find the "vae victis" project, gain every possible amount of info on it and advise as to how to treat the menace, whatever it is. Our operations have finally left the enemy reeling in alaric, we cannot lose now.

Campaign 3: congratulation again to the 30425th for enabling swift capture of the vae victis installation. Our scientists confirm the fact that this device is not a weapon in itself, however, the news are far from good. The Vae victis project uses the unique properties of the newly named charon system's cluster of black holes to litterally shatter the limites of ship's faster than light engines, making jumps of unheard lengths by opening a T-space rift up to nearly any immaginable system and to suppress the effect of time (an effect we believe to be caused by the proximity of the black holes). Given to our enemies, this ability would enable them to hit our core command systems by leaping over the established frontline and crush us with ease. Yet the renegade covert operations bureau has come out with a plan: The station's personnel are continuing to transmit TOG progress data so with any luck, it will be a while before they know we have captured the device. Using the lictor seneca we captured at drydock, we will infiltrate TOG space were we are to head to new rome in absolute secrecy. Our ships, dubbed the tourmentor, will proceed to the heart of the TOG (although not by a direct route as the TOG core systems have been amputated from the station's map computer as a measure of precaution), through a series of quick jumps. Once there, you will have to destroy in one swift strike the imperial senate, effectively terminating ceaser julianus and his overlords. We have been informed by probing in the tourmentor's journal that the senate is due to a meeting in 2 months, which would be the decisive moment to strike. Should you be uncovered, contain the news of an invasion by terminating the enemy, feel free to use at will the captured TOG interceptors and remember that everything (including the dreaded imperial guards) will be intend on defending ceaser.

Campaign4: the attack has succeeded: new rome (incidentally known as earth) has been destroyed by an antimatter device triggered with the destruction of the senate building. The loss of nova roma has brought agony to the TOG. However, all is not yet done: we have observed rising factions emerging from the TOG's ruin, one of them being the lictor, headed by high praetor augustus tarquini. Others consisting of loyalists, or neo ceaser preachers. The TOG must not be allowed to reform. You are to fan the flames between the factions until war looses the attruition for them. It also can be counsidered a valid objective to separate the ssora from the humans and to bring the ssora to swear allegiance to the commonwhealth: their lost might would be a crippling blow to the factions. Once command approuves it, return to the entry system so the vae victis device can return you to commonwhealth space. We have taken alaric thanks to your efforts, the other dukedoms, much less protected as conquered since hundreds of hears by the TOG, will prove extremely easy to retake now, given the TOG's collapse.

Campaign5: you are back and have brought the mission we have given you to an astounding success: the factions are warring against themselves, once inferiour to us, we will invade former TOG space in order to prevent any such disaster from arising, the narams, baufrin and kessrith have been attributed their former systems and the ssora have signed their allegiance to the commonwhealth. Yet before vea victis was deactivated, the remains of the lictor invaded our systems again: high praetor augustus has taken command of ceaser's flagship: the imperator and is using it to create an orgy of destruction on peaceful uninhabited worlds. the imperator is the pride of the former TOG's naval fleet: a heavily modified shiva battleship, 25% bigger, with 3 special spinal mounts and a cloaking system (similar to those mounted on the lictor's pugio prototype fighters). The imperator must be stopped at all costs, before more casualties happen. Be warned, the lictor's very elite NYX squadron, will contest the planned destruction of augustus and the imperator.

WHEW!!!!! ;7

Here's the story. hope you like it, and I hope I'll hear your comments on this.

best regards.

mike.

 

Offline gevatter Lars

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Re: renegade capital ships info
As the campaigns are layed out now its to straight to victory. A classic thing would be to let the destruction of the senate fail.
Give the campaigns some twists and near loosing pathes or even make  a complete campaign a "you lose and retreat" part.
Currently the entire thing seams a bit boring as it goes straight to victory.

Also you might concider to make that story an open ending so that there is room for other people to tell storys...that is if there are any people who are interested.
"Yes! That is my plan, and I see nothing wrong with it. I figure that if I stick to a stupid strategy long enough it might start to work."
 - comment to "Robotech: The Masters"

 

Offline starlord

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Re: renegade capital ships info
The thing is the renegade legion and the commonwhealth are nearing absolute defeat with the might of the TOG and all, so this attempt is really a last ditch through.

If I decided the senate would not be destroyed, wouldn't this mean doom for the renegades? Kind of a bad ending, isn't it?

Also, I hope you'll forgive the clumbsiness, but this is the first time I write a campaign script, and even If this campaign was meant to be a WCsaga MOD, I was intending it to follow the freespace system (and the freespace campaigns don't seem to be boring to me, even if they are linear): victory only. Yet I may be wrong, no? :p

Now don't get me wrong though: I thouroughly enjoy the fact that you commented in the first place and I see what you mean by your ideas: It would be closer to wing commander that way.

But I have to take into account my oh so very limited capabilities  :P

oh well!

best regards.

besides: at the end of renegade: battle for jacob's star, the story was up for us to explore and develop, and instead: the universe just died. According to my point of view, the story must be finished. Other fans still have the possibility to exploit the various battles in the rift or yolentrov counties between campaign 1 and 2 for instance, etc... (at least, that's my point of view).
But I will already need help if I am to plan out every single campaign mission, so can I do the partial victory/failure variants? I'm not that sure.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2007, 10:17:53 am by starlord »

 

Offline gevatter Lars

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Re: renegade capital ships info
The "looser wins" kind of story is told in endless variation in all kind of storys. Its allways heartbreaking when the loosers win in the end.
If you want to improve your story you might want to check books about drama and epic kinds of story telling. Some basics taken from that can improve your story a lot I think.

Lets take Freespace1+2 for example. Lets aside the characters...that dosn't exist...you get basicly this.
1) A very familiar/cliché setting. Good guys (you) and bad guys (Vasudans).
2) You got the first plot point. A new enemy appears (Shivans)
3) You combine yourself with your former enemy and think you will win since together you are stronger.
4) Next point...you don't win. You are thrown back and back.
5) Slowly you regain the upper hand and fight back.
6) The obviouse victory that comes with a heavy price.

That is the very basic storyline of FS (as far as I remember it).
Its interesting because it goes up and down and up and down. Also it was, to that point, something unaspected to have a former enemy as your friend. At least its the first time I remeber that it happend in this kind of strong way in a game.

Lets see for FS2

1) You think you can handle everything and only some strange guys are left.
2) A mysterie reveals itself and one of these strange dudes goes crazy.
3) Shivans return
4) You still think you can kick there ass.
5) Shivans prove you wrong and blow up a star.
6) You are the looser. You couldn't solve the mysterie, the Shivans kicked you around and earth is still lost. Conculusion....cliffhangar to [wasn't there dude that shoots you when you say the name?!] ...you get what I mean ^_^

So the basic shape of the FS storyline is full of turns and to me its not even close to anything like victory. If it would have been so I would have aspected that at the end of it we would have saved earth without loosing it or that we have solved what Admiral "beer" Bosh was bubbling all about and kicked the Shivans to there homeworld.

Wing Commander has the more forward lined story, if you only count in the games.
WC1 go out and save the sector. Done
WC2 go out and save another sector. Done
WC3 go out and finish the war. Done
WC4 Why the hell I am here, what should I do? Oh there are the bad guys *bang bang* World saved ^_^
WCP See WC1
WCSO See WC1 secret missions.

What made Wing Commander so greate with a simple storyline like that? Easy, it was the way of telling the story and the cool characters that where everywhere.
If you read the books and storys around the game you get a much deeper and rich universe that also has all kind of plotpoints and twists.

Why am I telling you all of this? Well I just want to give you a familiar example on how you could make your story more interesting and enjoyable.


I am not familiar with the story behind what you are doing and how far you know it yourself but you might get some nice hints and ideas on how to develop the story by re-reading some of the source materials. Maybe you could read some of the novels from this universe, if you haven't allready.
I only got one book...one I love and hate at the same time called "Damned if we do".
The writer takes forever to get the story going and explains and explains.....and then after about 2/3 of the book a story onfolds that is so totaly different written and cool that I was angry that it ended.

Well anyway maybe there are other books. I have only seen that the very first book was writen by one of my favorite BT writers William H. Keith Jr. I love the Grey Death Legion books.
PS: Very good example of the "underdog wins the day" scenario.


As for the posibilitys of the engine. Tolwyn has just shown in his Techdemo to WC4 that a mission branching system is possible and its also possible in other ways with the use of SOC missions and normal mission branching...as far as I remeber it.
So you can surely let the mission of destroying the Senat fail and continue the story and even then come out victorious. The battle will be just much harder.

Maybe you should make yourself free from the limits you might see and develop the story and then go back to see what of these parts can be done using the engine. That way you wouldn't restrict your creative flow.
At least that is my experiance when I work on other stuff. When I limit myself from the beginning I tend to drop good ideas. Later I regretting it because I found a way to solve the problem. Also if you don't worry about what you can't do your ideas come up much easier.


Well that is what I think. I wish you good luck with your project.
"Yes! That is my plan, and I see nothing wrong with it. I figure that if I stick to a stupid strategy long enough it might start to work."
 - comment to "Robotech: The Masters"

 

Offline starlord

  • 210
Re: renegade capital ships info
I see what you mean. I'll try to see (perhaps the branshing missions is the key after all) if I can get the story to be a little more "enjoyable" yet to me (but then again, this is perhaps I'm a newbie), to allow new rome not to be destroyed would be as alien as to allow kilrah not to be destroyed. see the drift?  :D

Oh well, I'll try to pull out the ideas. Thanks for the support anyway.