[General Battuta]

Yeah, but you're neglecting the power of the situation, which is neither genetic nor personally chosen.

[blackhole]

@trashman: While treating genetic disorders like cystic fibrosis and whatnot are good causes, when we start to "fix" people's brains we are going to start killing off our genius. Without geniuses, our current exponential progress will grind into something more linear until finally collapsing back in on itself after we've decided that everyone should have the same brain structure and be heterosexual and be nice to their parents. Can you imagine a future like that? Where everyone is normal? Not only would that be the most boring existence ever, we'd die out. There's a reason that nature invokes random genetic changes and promotes diversity, and that's because without diversity a species will get wiped out by a single environmental factor. Taking natural selection out of the equation, humans are able to problem solve so effectively because we can bring many unique minds to work on the same problem and thus are able to come up with a solution that none of those minds could have come up with on their own. The only reason we exist is because there are weirdos running around, so don't be so quick to say you want to "fix" weird people, because you have no idea what the consequences would be.

@High Max: Human beings may have control of their lives, but there's this cool thing called "Free Choice" that's also kind of significant. You can judge someone as much as you want, but that doesn't mean you're right.

[Aardwolf]

@trashman: While treating genetic disorders like cystic fibrosis and whatnot are good causes, when we start to "fix" people's brains we are going to start killing off our genius. Without geniuses, our current exponential progress will grind into something more linear until finally collapsing back in on itself after we've decided that everyone should have the same brain structure and be heterosexual and be nice to their parents. Can you imagine a future like that? Where everyone is normal? Not only would that be the most boring existence ever, we'd die out. There's a reason that nature invokes random genetic changes and promotes diversity, and that's because without diversity a species will get wiped out by a single environmental factor. Taking natural selection out of the equation, humans are able to problem solve so effectively because we can bring many unique minds to work on the same problem and thus are able to come up with a solution that none of those minds could have come up with on their own. The only reason we exist is because there are weirdos running around, so don't be so quick to say you want to "fix" weird people, because you have no idea what the consequences would be.

TrashMan seems to think that evolution is linear.

[Kie99]

The reason why nature 'invokes random genetic changes and promotes diversity'  is exactly that - random, it's because of chance.

Any argument in opposition to 'fixing' Transsexual-ism based around natural selection is a bit bizarre, given that transsexuals require an awful lot of artificial, unnatural changes in order to pass on their genetics, if it is even possible for them to do so.  Natural selection either condemns these people to live in a body they don't feel is the correct gender, presumably for a life of unhappiness, and allows them to pass on their genes, or causes them to be an evolutionary dead end if they switch genders.

I refuse to accept that humanity, or genius, would die out if transsexuals no longer existed, it's called the slippery slope fallacy for a reason.

[General Battuta]

Ah, but the question is whether the gene complex that creates trans individuals is linked to something else. A single gene is generally responsible for a tremendous number of different things.

It's a worthwhile question.

I still think that prenatal correction of the state is fine, but all individuals should have the ability to alter their sex if they see fit.

[Colonol Dekker]

There as a million and one excuses for being overweight. But there are no excuses for not getting up and working it off. .

[General Battuta]

Mmm, noooo, actually. Statistically, individuals almost always return to their genetic preset weight in the long run. Funnily enough, a lot of 'overweight' or 'obese' people who are actually at their healthy body weight do just fine.

This isn't to deprecate the value of exercise and a good diet - they're mandatory. But some people are just naturally fatter.

[Scotty]

There as a million and one excuses for being overweight. But there are no excuses for not getting up and working it off. .

When you can define "overweight" by anything other than completely abitrary benchmarks, we can make some progress.

Damn, ninja'd by Battuta.

EDIT:  To make this post not a complete waste of space, I suggest anyone interested google the term "Set-point."

EDIT THE SECOND:  I just realized that is a tennis term as well as what I was thinking of.  The definition I was thinking of is "the body's tendency to maintain or return to a 'set' weight."  Hence, set-point.

[Colonol Dekker]

Assuming they are happy at an "above average" natural weight i'll happily agree.

[Scotty]

You know as well as I do and anyone else here that "above average" means overweight, regardless of what a person's natural weight is.

[Colonol Dekker]

Not really, if the majority of natural builds was a bit bigger than the "norm" at present. Then would a current average be considered skinny? I'm putting thought into these replies, don't misread

[Wobble73]

It all depends on who classes what is an average weight! For some people, the norm is higher than others, I am under weight, compared to the norm, am I to be disregarded the same way?

And if  than we screen birth defect's during pregnancy then do we exclude people with neuro muscular dystrophy, such as Stephen Hawking?

[High Max]

^_^

[Scotty]

Max, this may come as a shock to your gentle sensibilities, but a whole hell of a lot of the time, genetics plays one of the biggest roles in determining weight (followed closely by upbringing).

[High Max]

*_*

[Scotty]

I must be doing somthing right.

Yeah, you got genetically lucky.  I didn't.  I'm stuck at 210 after three days a week in the gym and marching band besides for the last four months.  That means that by a BMI, I'm techincally obese.  And there isn't a damn thing I can do about it, not in the long run.

I don't think you realize just how holier-than-thou you come off as when you spout this junk about lifestyles.

[High Max]

*_*

[iamzack]

He's just one of those "diet and exercise fix everything" loonies.

[High Max]

*_*

[Scotty]

Max, every single one of those ailments you mentioned have been conclusively linked to genetic disorders.