[Flipside]

WW1 was wierd, it was kind of all started by a Documental Domino effect. Kind of like a car crash in slow motion, everyone could see that this was going to end in a completely avoidable mess, but no-one knew how to put on the brakes.

[Luis Dias]

WW1 was wierd, it was kind of all started by a Documental Domino effect. Kind of like a car crash in slow motion, everyone could see that this was going to end in a completely avoidable mess, but no-one knew how to put on the brakes.

Just like the current self-destruction that Europe is steadfasting into...

[Mikes]

ok, so then we are all in agreement, religion can be a motivating factor for atrocities, but is not required.

Kinda like high cholesterol can be a motivating factor for hearth attacks, but is not required?

[MP-Ryan]

Actually no. I'm going back further than you are, that's all.

Qutb may have had ideas which have influenced Al-Qaeda, but the roots of the current war on terror extend well beyond the narrow confines of Al-Qaeda.  The insurgencies in Afghanistan and Iraq have been inspired more by nationalism than religious coherence (though again, it's a useful tool that the leadership has to bring people in the region together against a common enemy, before returning to factional infighting).

[karajorma]

I won't disagree with that, but no Al-Qaeda, no invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq, no insurgencies.

[Grizzly]

WW1 was wierd, it was kind of all started by a Documental Domino effect. Kind of like a car crash in slow motion, everyone could see that this was going to end in a completely avoidable mess, but no-one knew how to put on the brakes.

Just like the current self-destruction that Europe is steadfasting into...

Brakes have been put on. Were fine for now (emphasis on the for now thing). Wonder how things are over in the US - Last time I heard was that the Republicans and Democrats were shooting each other's plan down.

ok, so then we are all in agreement, religion can be a motivating factor for atrocities, but is not required.

Kinda like high cholesterol can be a motivating factor for hearth attacks, but is not required?

There's plenty of other ways to get terminal diseases.

[mxlm]

The insurgencies in Afghanistan and Iraq have been inspired more by nationalism

Iraq maybe, but Afghanistan? Nationalism? I seriously doubt that's correct.

[Dragon]

Wonder how things are over in the US - Last time I heard was that the Republicans and Democrats were shooting each other's plan down.

Well, only two parties are doing this out there.
Poland is still standing (though I wonder how long) despite having more than four of these bunches of idiots constantly arguing over the smallest things, a rather silly president, charismatic but useless prime minister, completely incompetent normal ministers and opposition that prefers to debate about the plane crash from a year ago instead of current problems.
I think that US will be fine. They at least had admitted that they're going bankrupt, while Poland still says that it's "doing well" (Well, it is. Compared to Greece).

[Bobboau]

Compared to Greece

Africa is doing well...

[Grizzly]

Compared to Greece

Africa is doing well...

What - the entire continent?

[MP-Ryan]

The insurgencies in Afghanistan and Iraq have been inspired more by nationalism

Iraq maybe, but Afghanistan? Nationalism? I seriously doubt that's correct.

What do the Taliban, Al-Qaeda, and a large chunk of ordinary Afghans have in common?  That's right - a desire to throw everyone else the hell out of Afghanistan and run the country as they see fit.  That's pretty much the definition of good-old-19th-and-20th-century nationalism, the kind seen quite ominously in the lead-up to both of the world wars.

[Flipside]

WW1 was wierd, it was kind of all started by a Documental Domino effect. Kind of like a car crash in slow motion, everyone could see that this was going to end in a completely avoidable mess, but no-one knew how to put on the brakes.

Just like the current self-destruction that Europe is steadfasting into...

Actually, it's quite the opposite, the first depressions were part of the fuel for a war that cost millions of lives, this time round, Europe has fallen back into the 'married couple' relationship of pointing fingers and complaining. Whilst far from perfect, it's a safer solution than we came up with last time. I'll agree to a certain degree that this should have been seen coming, but then, it is a global depression, it's far more than Europe involved. It's possible the EU won't come out of this the same shape, I'll agree, but I don't see the cataclysmic chain reaction of events happening that led to a world war this time round, the solution is assumed to be Systemic, not Imperial.

[Nuke]

our tendency to avoid world war will only last until the memory of those wars fade. when the last of the people who remember it die out and there is no one left to defend the history we have of those events. then we will turn to world war once more and nukes will fall from the sky. it will be a glorious end to this so called civilization of ours.

[Grizzly]

our tendency to avoid world war will only last until the memory of those wars fade. when the last of the people who remember it die out and there is no one left to defend the history we have of those events. then we will turn to world war once more and nukes will fall from the sky. it will be a glorious end to this so called civilization of ours.

This post made me wonder - How war eager would the Americans be when the American civil war was not the last war to be fought on American soil?

[The E]

Depends on whether they won or lost.

[jr2]

Too bad we weren't a little less eager for war in the forties... Sprechen ze Deutsch, anyone? 

[Ghostavo]

Yeah, because we all know Russia wasn't the major player in WW2... oh wait!

[Mars]

Like Russia wasn't on the brink of collapse themselves during WWII.

I am NOT saying that America WON WWII, I am saying that it definitely helped.

[Nuke]

id say that america lost the least in the second world war. when you think about it nobody really wins a war. you might have a war where you loose less fighting it than you would not fighting it, wars for independence for example, even the civil war could fall into this category. but war always has a cost.

[StarSlayer]

Like Russia wasn't on the brink of collapse themselves during WWII.

I am NOT saying that America WON WWII, I am saying that it definitely helped.

The Soviets certainly benefited greatly from the massive influx of materiel from the US and UK.  Especially since most of it was logistical and allowed there factories to focus on building weapons such as the T34 and IL2s.  Certainly the Germans had a high degree of tactical mastery, much better then the Soviets but from Stavka's Operational Art from a strategic level was far beyond that of the German or the rest of the Allies.  The West never really appreciated it and like to believe the Russians won solely on having more men the the Wehrmacht had bullets but Soviet Strategic Offenses where brutally powerful and well coordinated and essentially ate entire German Army Groups.