[sigtau]

FS2 is one of 's favorite games, maybe their absolute favorite, and they were really crushed when it didn't do well.

I know I'm replying to this several weeks late, but hell, I feel like this needs to be said: In a video interview, I remember Dan Wentz himself commenting on the FS series in general, and his disappointment in FS2's lack of success.  He said something along these lines:

It was the best game we'd ever created... and it was marginally successful.

So yeah, I'd say it was a lack of marketing or lack of public knowledge of the game's existence that killed retail FreeSpace productions.

Also, on the notion of getting FS3 made by recruiting the spare time of its original creators--I like the idea a lot, but would it be worth getting in touch with people living in Illinois?  I mean, keeping online contact is difficult in itself--people can just ignore you outright if they feel like it.  It's a little more difficult to do this if we were to organize something in person to meet up with some or all of these people--but consequently, it'd be a lot harder for them to pretend we don't exist if we did something in person.  Anyone live in the northern Central timezone?

[Sushi]

I don't understand why people think that FS3 (official or otherwise) on the same engine would be any better than what we already have from the mod community.

[Rga_Noris]

I've always felt that FS2's poor sales is what prompted the release of the source code. Sort of a "Well, we don't have the cash to do anything more with this, so you guys give it a go..."

I think that if FS2 did really well, FS3 would have followed suit and the series would have ended... and surely by now its fan base would be mild. Just old timers occasionally digging out dusty CD's.

Thank God it was a sales flop.

[General Battuta]

I have come up with an idea on how to create something which is the closest thing to a real FS3 that there could ever be, but also satisfying us more seasoned members who are reluctant to see such a thing created for fear of it seriously harming canon, or that an unknown might bastardize it.

Firstly, this would have to be understood as being totally non-cannon... at best, fannon.  Secondly, it would preclude the idea of it being on any new game engine.  It would therefore be made for FSO.

Volition, THQ, and Interplay.  All three of these companies hold various portions of the rights to the game, but none are willing or able to do anything with them.  However, even if they did, it is likely that the direction would be so alien from the existing type of story, as to be a complete disappointment to all.  This leaves only one conclusion... the game must be made by the only people that the FS community as a whole trusts with the story... the original game designers themselves.  We already have had contact with at least two of the original developers, story and now music.  If we could coax enough of the original creators, intermixed with HLP campaign alumni, with close partnership with the FSO team, I could see a polished product being released to the community as the "the next best thing to FS3 you'll ever see".  Not saying that campaigns such as BP, Inferno  , and many others aren't awesome and well created campaigns, but this would have the prestige of being the FS3 that the Volition design team wanted to make.  It would of course have to be a non-profit project, just as all the rest of the non-cannon campaigns over the years have been, and that's assuming that the original designers I have mentioned, aren't under some kind of legal restraints preventing them from participating in any FS-related project not authorized by Volition, THQ, Interplay, or whoever owns the story rights, in any way shape or form.

Now, I understand that something like what I have proposed is exceedingly unlikely, and equivalent of a daydream, but it would probably also be the most likely way it could be created, and the most likely it could be accepted by the community as a whole.

I doubt this could actually be done, but I felt like sharing this concept with the community.

This is an idea that's been around for years.

Honestly, there were aspects of the plan for FS3 that were already kind of disappointing and didn't live up to what we'd started to imagine among ourselves. I'd rather have a swarm of fan projects, each of them running in a different direction.

The only thing I think HLP has never bested is Jason Scott's spare, punchy writing.

[Grizzly]

What if Violition went around and did a Halo Space Sim?

Surely there must be a market for that?

[General Battuta]

What if Violition went around and did a Halo Space Sim?

Surely there must be a market for that?

The Halo IP is owned by Microsoft, and Volition works for THQ.

[G0atmaster]

Question:  I recently read an article, I think in reference to Tribes: Ascend or some other Free-to-play or low-cost game, that talked about how the gaming industry, due to the advent of social media, no longer revolves around who has the biggest marketing budget.

In my own circles, I've rallied a rather large amount of support and interest in Freespace 2 Open, simply by telling people it was a good game.

Due to social media, a favorite band of mine, Five Iron Frenzy, recently asked for $30,000 via kickstarter to make a new album.  They received $200,000, and thus, do not need a record label, and are free to be creative.

Due to social media, good products market themselves.  I believe many of Freespace 2's problems would not exist for Freespace 3 because of this.

Just my 2 cents.

[headdie]

Question:  I recently read an article, I think in reference to Tribes: Ascend or some other Free-to-play or low-cost game, that talked about how the gaming industry, due to the advent of social media, no longer revolves around who has the biggest marketing budget.

In my own circles, I've rallied a rather large amount of support and interest in Freespace 2 Open, simply by telling people it was a good game.

Due to social media, a favorite band of mine, Five Iron Frenzy, recently asked for $30,000 via kickstarter to make a new album.  They received $200,000, and thus, do not need a record label, and are free to be creative.

Due to social media, good products market themselves.  I believe many of Freespace 2's problems would not exist for Freespace 3 because of this.

Just my 2 cents.

You still need to persuade Interplay to licence someone to make the game, also there still needs to be a demand for social media to work.  paying £3-£6  for a game is very different to paying £30-£40.

[shadestalker]

Have anyone 'dared' the company holding the IP rights to do a 'survey of potential interest' by putting up a kickstarter project with the goal of what they think would be acceptable before they would bother with it? Given, ofc, that it was a 'true' sequel to the series, meaning it included all the 'jazz' that made the previous games so awesome, and weren't dumbed down in terms of squad control or ship customization (or ease of these), but rather texpanded on it?

With MP being touted all the time by big companies, I could imagine this part aspect of the series as well might having a 'positive' ring. Being moddable with a new FRED might be more problematic, though, although it is one of the reasons some games keep interest for long.

I realize kickstarter is normally used by small companies or indies, but I don't see the issue for a bigger company to use it as a 'probing area' to see if there is a market for a specific product.

[headdie]

Have anyone 'dared' the company holding the IP rights to do a 'survey of potential interest' by putting up a kickstarter project with the goal of what they think would be acceptable before they would bother with it? Given, ofc, that it was a 'true' sequel to the series, meaning it included all the 'jazz' that made the previous games so awesome, and weren't dumbed down in terms of squad control or ship customization (or ease of these), but rather texpanded on it?

With MP being touted all the time by big companies, I could imagine this part aspect of the series as well might having a 'positive' ring. Being moddable with a new FRED might be more problematic, though, although it is one of the reasons some games keep interest for long.

I realize kickstarter is normally used by small companies or indies, but I don't see the issue for a bigger company to use it as a 'probing area' to see if there is a market for a specific product.

from what we can work out Interplay, who is the stalling point here, just don't have the financial resources to commit to a decent case study without serious intent to follow up on it.

[SpardaSon21]

Interplay has money?  I thought they were just one guy working out of his basement by now.

[headdie]

Interplay has money?  I thought they were just one guy working out of his basement by now.

from a little research I did a few months ago I think they are worth about $3.5 million on the stock markets, so yes they officially have money / ability to raise money, just not enough to do anything in the serious gaming market

[Killer Whale]

My personal wish for a FS3 lies in popularity (a bit) and engine (a lot), the advent of BP IMHO nullifies my wish for a canon story successor. I seem to have come to the conclusion that the Freespace engine is old and inefficient and that a new title would include far greater graphical capabilities plus whatever SCP can cook up. Is that true?
Hmm... That's rather loaded, I'll see if I can break it down: Is Freespace Open highly inefficient compared to modern games? Would FS3 outdo FSOpen in terms of raw power? Would FS3 necessarily be open source?

Yeah, at this point, I'd quite happily settle for any random high-quality space sim that follows the FS/Wing Commander vein.

The implications of which are that none exist? [/genuine]

[headdie]

Yeah, at this point, I'd quite happily settle for any random high-quality space sim that follows the FS/Wing Commander vein.

The implications of which are that none exist? [/genuine]

so far as I am aware there have not been a high quality commercial game since Y2K.

[Vip]

so far as I am aware there have not been a high quality commercial game since Y2K.

Yup, Starlancer (2000) was the last game that could be called a space sim in the sense that we understand it, even if it was a bit too dumbed down in some areas (capital ships were far too easy to destroy, for example).

There's also StarShatter: The Gathering Storm from 2006. It wasn't as user friendly as FreeSpace or Wing Commander, but it let you control capital ships. And it went open source in 2011. There's a lot of some great mods out there for it, even if graphics and controls could use some improvements.

There are the X series games, but since they are open-worlded and focus more on economy and what-not, I don't really consider them to be space sims.

[shadestalker]

as for non-fs games, I'm having some hope for the kickstarter project "Starlight", although they still have some funding to go before it will see light. (http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/732317316/starlight-inceptiontm)

I would still prefer a 'real' FS3, though 

[Cyborg17]

I just pledged for that one. (part of the reason being that pledging a certain amount buys you the game if it's made)  If we want to see future Space Sims we probably should get behind this one.  The project team sounds competent and it sounds like they understand the low cost business strategy.  It would probably make a decent return if it manages to make it.

[jr2]

Yeah, $15 Isn't a bad deal for a game.

EDIT: pledged $16

[SirCumference]

I agree with other members of the forum in that I'd rather not see an official FS3 made. While it would be interesting and I'd definitely buy it, I think that having an official end of the story would kill the creativity of the modders. Right now we don't know how it ends, so we're free to dream up any number of mods to continue the story. Also, I like what's happening with the source code project, and I'd hate to see it become obsolete with the release of a new closed-source engine.

[jr2]

Wasn't there a fan-made alternative storyline to FS2 in the works?  I'm not sure FS3 would be that much of a creativity killer.  Especially if the Shivans turned out to be the tip of an iceberg.  Then, you could still make your own FS2 sequels, plus FS4 and anything in-between.  Adding creativity into the FS universe from a canon source shouldn't stifle creativity; it should spark more!

My thoughts, FWIW.