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Author Topic: America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!  (Read 47072 times)

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Offline TheCelestialOne

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #100 on: July 09, 2002, 06:03:53 am
Portable Maxim!
"I also like to stomp my enemies, incite rebellions, start the occasional war, and spend lazy hours preening my battle aura."

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Offline Sandwich

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #101 on: July 09, 2002, 06:49:13 am
Quote
Originally posted by vyper

Don't they sell you Fighter parts? :p


Who, the US? Yeah, after they shut down the Lavi Project because it would have been too advanced a fighter beyond anything they had. :doubt:
SERIOUSLY...! | {The Sandvich Bar} - Rhino-FS2 Tutorial | CapShip Turret Upgrade | The Complete FS2 Ship List | System Background Package

"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
 

Offline Ace Pace

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #102 on: July 09, 2002, 09:53:12 am
wasn't it shut down because of the  costs?
 

Offline Sandwich

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Reply #103 on: July 09, 2002, 10:44:18 am
Quote
Originally posted by Ace Pace
wasn't it shut down because of the  costs?


Yes, but that's the sneaky part - the US stopped funding it because of the reason I gave above, and since Israel didn't have the financial means to continue on her own... :headz: :snipe:
SERIOUSLY...! | {The Sandvich Bar} - Rhino-FS2 Tutorial | CapShip Turret Upgrade | The Complete FS2 Ship List | System Background Package

"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
 

Offline Zeronet

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #104 on: July 09, 2002, 10:50:41 am
Quote
Originally posted by sandwich


Who, the US? Yeah, after they shut down the Lavi Project because it would have been too advanced a fighter beyond anything they had. :doubt:


We sell you Fighter parts for your F16 Fighters and you used some modified Centurions.
I dont think Sandwich wasnt saying Britian was Primitive.
Got Ether?
 

Offline Ace Pace

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #105 on: July 09, 2002, 10:53:17 am
thats interesting, greedy US.
 

Offline CP5670

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #106 on: July 09, 2002, 11:14:18 am
If the US government actually did that, it would be one of the few smart things they did. :D
 

Offline Sandwich

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #107 on: July 09, 2002, 04:40:59 pm
Quote
Originally posted by CP5670
If the US government actually did that, it would be one of the few smart things they did. :D


Let's not get started, but just remember that "smart" is relative. :D :lol:
SERIOUSLY...! | {The Sandvich Bar} - Rhino-FS2 Tutorial | CapShip Turret Upgrade | The Complete FS2 Ship List | System Background Package

"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
 

Offline CP5670

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #108 on: July 09, 2002, 04:46:04 pm
It was in their own interests, so it is "smart" as far as that goes. :D
 

Offline Sandwich

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Reply #109 on: July 09, 2002, 05:00:20 pm
Quote
Originally posted by CP5670
It was in their own interests, so it is "smart" as far as that goes. :D


It was in their interests to prevent a nation that was not only friendly, but downright dependant on them, from developing a superior fighter? Huh?
SERIOUSLY...! | {The Sandvich Bar} - Rhino-FS2 Tutorial | CapShip Turret Upgrade | The Complete FS2 Ship List | System Background Package

"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
 

Offline CP5670

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #110 on: July 09, 2002, 05:01:47 pm
Obviously you don't want someone else taking over a position that you may have. :p (leader in military technology)
 

Offline Sandwich

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Reply #111 on: July 09, 2002, 05:06:25 pm
Quote
Originally posted by CP5670
Obviously you don't want someone else taking over a position that you may have. :p (leader in military technology)


AFAIK it was being co-developed by both Israel and the US, but besides - our millitary tech may be on average a step behind the US, but we certainly have a more experienced military. :doubt:

Now, I don't have to dredge up that article about those mock-combat dogfights that Israel did with the US, do I? :D
SERIOUSLY...! | {The Sandvich Bar} - Rhino-FS2 Tutorial | CapShip Turret Upgrade | The Complete FS2 Ship List | System Background Package

"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
  

Offline CP5670

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #112 on: July 09, 2002, 05:13:29 pm
In the end, it is all technology though (fusion bomb, anyone?); most military experts would agree there. :p :D
 

Offline Sandwich

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Reply #113 on: July 09, 2002, 05:17:24 pm
Quote
Originally posted by CP5670
In the end, it is all technology though (fusion bomb, anyone?); most military experts would agree there. :p :D


No, if anything, it's the opposite, although I tend towards a healthy mix, personally. :)

Look at the Romans against the barbarian hordes, or any of those sort of examples throughout history - yeah, technology helps a heck of a lot, but it's not the bottom line.
SERIOUSLY...! | {The Sandvich Bar} - Rhino-FS2 Tutorial | CapShip Turret Upgrade | The Complete FS2 Ship List | System Background Package

"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
 

Offline CP5670

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #114 on: July 09, 2002, 05:23:35 pm
If there is enough of a difference, that is really all that matters; the atom bomb has shown that to be true. Conventional armies would be of no use in a new world war in the usual sense (if one came up); it would be fought with ICBMs. The opponents to this say that hordes are what matter, so population can defeat technology, but I personally cannot see how a collection of savages can beat some nukes. :p
 

Offline Sandwich

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Reply #115 on: July 09, 2002, 05:28:33 pm
Quote
Originally posted by CP5670
If there is enough of a difference, that is really all that matters; the atom bomb has shown that to be true. Conventional armies would be of no use in a new world war in the usual sense (if one came up); it would be fought with ICBMs. The opponents to this say that hordes are what matter, so population can defeat technology, but I personally cannot see how a collection of savages can beat some nukes. :p


That's not quite how the argument goes - it's more of a "you can have all the nukes you want, but if us 'hordes' have a man on the inside in the right place at the right time.... hehehe ;7".

Race cars are only as good as their drivers, a pattern which is repeated the world over.
SERIOUSLY...! | {The Sandvich Bar} - Rhino-FS2 Tutorial | CapShip Turret Upgrade | The Complete FS2 Ship List | System Background Package

"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
 

Offline CP5670

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #116 on: July 09, 2002, 05:38:36 pm
Well, one man with the right technology (or knowledge, in other words) can in theory take on the whole world and win with almost mathematical certainty. :p
 

Offline Grey Wolf

America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #117 on: July 09, 2002, 05:56:46 pm
If we have WWIII, the people who flee to the moon will have a great reading light: The glowing, irradiated surface of Terra. Hmm.... Let's see.... 10000 nuclear missile strikes, with quite a few probably at nuclear reators such as Three Mile Point.... Yep, that's a bright idea.
You see things; and you say "Why?" But I dream things that never were; and I say "Why not?" -George Bernard Shaw
 

Offline Warlock

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America, Happy Fourth, now wake up and smell the roses!
Reply #118 on: July 09, 2002, 06:08:01 pm
Makes perfect since if funding was canceled because the fighter would be far better than anything we have.

Let's recall the entire "arms race" concepts. There was a reason so much effort went into becoming tops in military advancements.

And we have seen "allies" at times make a quick change.

Also is the fact that yes then an allie would have a better toy...BUT the us would not control if that buddy decided to sell a few extra toys,...gotta look at the bigger picture.


Or the simple one...we will never be making those judgement calls,...deal with them :)
Warlock



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Offline Sandwich

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Reply #119 on: July 09, 2002, 06:19:50 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Grey Wolf 2009
If we have WWIII, the people who flee to the moon will have a great reading light: The glowing, irradiated surface of Terra. Hmm.... Let's see.... 10000 nuclear missile strikes, with quite a few probably at nuclear reators such as Three Mile Point.... Yep, that's a bright idea.


Einstein said:
Quote

I don't know what weapons World War Three will be fought with, but World War Four will be fought with sticks and stones.
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"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill
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