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Offline darkdaej

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Vasudan takeover - a theory
I've been replaying FS1 and 2 quite a bit since I've reinstalled FSO last week and made my "grand" comeback on this forum.  When exposed to the lore once again, I began noticing things I hadn't seen back in the day and I think I've uncovered a potential plot thread for what FS3 might have led do - or at least something which  :v-old: had in mind when creating the games.

I believe that Vasudan Emperor Khonsu II planned to incorporate the Terrans into the Vasudan Imperium as a vassal species.  How did I come to this conclusion; you might ask?  Of course, several elements throughout FS2 seem to hint towards that being the case.
Of course, you may say the Vasudans genuinely wanted to ally with the Terrans…and the everyday Vasudan citizen might agree with the publicly stated goals of the Vasudan government towards the Terrans…but I believe it’s all a political game designed to slowly erode Terran political clout in the galaxy.  Here’s why I believe this is the case:

1: The structure of the GTVA’s government.
As we know, the Galactic Terran-Vasudan Alliance is made up of three branches:  The GTVA Security Council, which seems to be the governmental branch of the military/judiciary, the General Assembly, what seems to be an elected body of representatives representing the civilian governments of both races…and the Vasudan Imperium, basically meaning Khonsu II and his aides having control of an entire branch of government.
Now if the General Assembly was only made up of Terran representatives and did not represent Vasudans at all, we could say that we have equal representation.  One Terran Branch, one Vasudan branch and one united military/judicial branch.
However, the lore omits to mention the makeup of the General Assembly and what information we have never mentions it’s a human-only body.  Now if I’m right and the GA is made up of representatives of both races, this gives Vasudans far more power than the Terrans in how government is run because not only to they have some level of control of the civilian government, Khonsu himself has his own branch.  While this is speculation, it’s likely that he has Veto power over the GA’s policy proposals. 

2: The GTA after the Great War/Hades Rebellion
Canon states that the GTA was collapsing into a bunch of regional blocs following the events of FS1/Silent Threat.  While some may argue that this was a golden opportunity for Vasudans to finish off the Terrans who were increasingly disorganized, they simply had no ability to do so.  The Vasudans had lost their homeworld and likely the lion’s share of their industrial production.  Even if Khonsu wanted to crush the Terrans, it was impossible.  However using their governmental crisis under the guise of a long-term alliance and taking the opportunity to form a unified government for both species (favouring the Vasudans who did the leg work uniting the Terran factions), over time it would become possible to undermine Terran authority and allow Khonsu II to effectively rule over them.

3: The Civil War.
While Vasudans were the initial victims of the NTF’s insurgency as Bosch secured Ancient archeological sites, the brunt of the fighting was done by Terrans themselves – at least from what we could see during the end of the civil war.  The Vasudans were apparently content to (mostly)sit on the sidelines while two human factions pummeled each other.  Regardless of how you see it, this can only be good for Khonsu’s plans to subjugate Terrans.  While Terrans lose ships and manpower, Vasudans can keep their numbers strong, maybe even surpassing the Terrans in overall number of warships.

4: The Second Shivan Incursion
This was purely a matter of “luck”, but FS2’s story does end, once again, with the Vasudans in a position of power.  The Shivans are held back, Terrans lost one of (if not the most) populated colony they had along with dozens of warships, hundreds of fighter craft and hundreds of thousands of people.  Vasudans?  Oh, they maybe lost a Mentu or Sobek here and there, but where they might have gotten away from the Shivans with a bloody nose, the Terrans were left in Intensive Care…

All in all, I have a feeling that a Vasudan takeover was in the cards for a FS2 sequel/expansion.

Any thoughts?  Counter-arguments?  I’d love to hear what you have to say 😊


 

Offline 0rph3u5

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
First, mind if I take some of it for the background materials on the NTF in The Lost Generation - Ashcroft, up to verbatim quotes? I have some in-universe conspiracy theories already in play but since one of the most insidious aspects of consipracy theories is that they can be quite à la carte, more is always better :D

Now on to the objections:

1) Your analogy of the GTVA to a national government is flawed. It actually mirrors the structure of the UN, the main bodies of which are the General Assembly (where each UN member state has a seat and a vote) and the Security Council (which has a number of permanent and temporary members; with the permanent members holding a veto power against any resoultion brought before the body).

2) There is no evidence what the Vasudan Imperium actually is - but considering that there are able paralells between the PVN and the popular conception of the Japanse Naval forces in WW2, it is not beyond possibility that the Vasudan Imperium simply is meant to be something like Japan's Imperial Household Agency.

3) You picture of the NTF rebellion is based on a limited information falacy. Canonically, you are playing a terran pilot on the Acquitance, which appears to be acting in rapid response capacity rather than to engage in prolonged fighting of any kind - that appears to be job of more local units, such as the 11th or 13th Vasudan Battlegroups . Since the information you are given during any given briefing is limited to your current posting, you cannot infer from that what other units are doing unless a Command Briefing comes and expands on the events, e.g the CB for The Sixth Wonder mentions a failed campaign against Sirius.

4) As related to 3, the Mission Briefing for Into the Maelstrom, points out that relations are strained which lead to an active seperation of terran and vasudan units in the field.

5) Same as 3 but for the Sathanas invasion. You participate in a low number of engagements, which might be key engagements as the 70th is an elite unit, but not in everything that is going on - the mission briefing from FS2's Exodus onward try to give you a sense of scale of the Acquitane's operations; now scale that up with ships we can infer from canon to be in Capella at this point: the Colossus and the Messana, as well as possibly the Memphis, the Hedetet and the Carthage.

6) If the Vasudans were holding back, why deploy the Memphis (see Straight, No Chaser), the Psamtik (see Fog of War and onwards) and the Toeris (see Speaking in Tongues) to the Nebula? - That's a significant committment, esspecially since in the CB of Battle of the Wilderness it is stated that destruction of Ravana did not suppress Shivan activity in the Nebula but it intensified in response to the loss of the Ravana.
"When you work with water, you have to know and respect it. When you labour to subdue it, you have to understand that one day it may rise up and turn all your labours into nothing. For what is water, which seeks to make all things level, which has no taste or colour of its own, but a liquid form of Nothing?" - Graham Swift, Waterland

"As you sought to steal a kingdom for yourself, so must you do again, a thousand times over. For a theft, a true theft, must be practiced to be earned." - The terms of Nysa's curse, Pathfinder: Kingmaker

"...because they are not Dragons."

 

Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
Orpheus has a very good response, I just wanted to say that this conspiracy theory was probably conveyed by admiral Bosch himself to rally his NTF rebellion in the first place. I'd even go so far as to imply that these dark plots are always on the back of everyone's minds and backtracking any progress between the two species, still too afraid of each other to give in to implicit trust.

 
Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
Of course the UN parallel comes to mind, but :v-old: refuses to give any concrete infos on that so you can say what you want.
One way or another, while the Vasudans lost their homeworld FS made it rather clear that they left VP earlier and probably had more industry in the colonies than the Terrran systems which were mostly depending on Sol; so the Vasudans would dominate the GTVA by economic power alone even if the politics would be balanced 50/50.

Regarding Capella, the Supernova cutscene shows 2 Hatshepsuts, 1 of them blowing up so I think they were certainly more involved than the engine/computers allowed to show back then.

 
Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
Pretty much what Orph3u5 said, although I think it would work as an in-universe conspiracy theory for neo-Neo Terran Frontists.

Thanks to the player's narrow point of view, there's a lot of blanks in our perception of the FS lore, so us fans have to make a number assumptions, guesses and interpretations.
For instance, others have made the assumption that the General Assembly is a purely Terran institution, with the Security Council being a mixed-species body.

 
Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
It would make kinda sense to have the General Assembly as the Terrans fell into "power-blocks" instead of a unified state, so they would represent every Terran system.

I had a different take on the NTF than "Average Anti-Vasudan Violence guys" and "let's call ET" though, with more economic interests but that's just my headcanon.

 

Offline Colt

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
1: The structure of the GTVA’s government.
As we know, the Galactic Terran-Vasudan Alliance is made up of three branches:  The GTVA Security Council, which seems to be the governmental branch of the military/judiciary, the General Assembly, what seems to be an elected body of representatives representing the civilian governments of both races…and the Vasudan Imperium, basically meaning Khonsu II and his aides having control of an entire branch of government.
Now if the General Assembly was only made up of Terran representatives and did not represent Vasudans at all, we could say that we have equal representation.  One Terran Branch, one Vasudan branch and one united military/judicial branch.
However, the lore omits to mention the makeup of the General Assembly and what information we have never mentions it’s a human-only body.  Now if I’m right and the GA is made up of representatives of both races, this gives Vasudans far more power than the Terrans in how government is run because not only to they have some level of control of the civilian government, Khonsu himself has his own branch.  While this is speculation, it’s likely that he has Veto power over the GA’s policy proposals. 
In my admittedly simplistic view, I've thought of the system of government as being Security Council>Terran+Vasudan, General Assembly>Terran and Vasudan Imperium (self-explanatory). Khonsu II would still probably be the most powerful person in the GTVA, since he would be the representative of an entire species and as emperor would have the final say in many Vasudan matters.

2: The GTA after the Great War/Hades Rebellion
Canon states that the GTA was collapsing into a bunch of regional blocs following the events of FS1/Silent Threat.  While some may argue that this was a golden opportunity for Vasudans to finish off the Terrans who were increasingly disorganized, they simply had no ability to do so.  The Vasudans had lost their homeworld and likely the lion’s share of their industrial production.  Even if Khonsu wanted to crush the Terrans, it was impossible.  However using their governmental crisis under the guise of a long-term alliance and taking the opportunity to form a unified government for both species (favouring the Vasudans who did the leg work uniting the Terran factions), over time it would become possible to undermine Terran authority and allow Khonsu II to effectively rule over them.
I like this one. In addition to losses of material, ships and personnel during the war with the Shivans it's probably safe to also acknowledge the threat of the HoL complicating any attempted offensive against the Terrans. Soft power would be key here, while the PVE/Imperium's military could focus on the insurgency.

3: The Civil War.
While Vasudans were the initial victims of the NTF’s insurgency as Bosch secured Ancient archeological sites, the brunt of the fighting was done by Terrans themselves – at least from what we could see during the end of the civil war.  The Vasudans were apparently content to (mostly)sit on the sidelines while two human factions pummeled each other.  Regardless of how you see it, this can only be good for Khonsu’s plans to subjugate Terrans.  While Terrans lose ships and manpower, Vasudans can keep their numbers strong, maybe even surpassing the Terrans in overall number of warships.
Given that Sirius borders both Deneb and Alpha Centauri, the NTF have always been in a position to cut off the Vasudans and to bombard their major colonies (ex: Cygnus Prime). As far as we know, their are only 5 "Vasudan" systems; two of which are under attack and the two more at risk of being cut off. This alone would see the Vasudans take on the lion's share of the fighting in that region.

4: The Second Shivan Incursion
This was purely a matter of “luck”, but FS2’s story does end, once again, with the Vasudans in a position of power.  The Shivans are held back, Terrans lost one of (if not the most) populated colony they had along with dozens of warships, hundreds of fighter craft and hundreds of thousands of people.  Vasudans?  Oh, they maybe lost a Mentu or Sobek here and there, but where they might have gotten away from the Shivans with a bloody nose, the Terrans were left in Intensive Care…
4: Orpheus and Nightmare raise good points. The Vasudans definetly suffered more losses then just errant cruisers. I agree with your bloody nose vs intensive care result.

In the aftermath of Capella, I'd think that any plans for a Vasudan takeover would have been scrapped at least temporarily. As Petrarch states during the final mission, the allied fleet had been "pulverized", so maintaining security over their colonies and standing-by to intercept any new Shivan incursion with what remains of their battlegroups would probably be in the Vasudans primary interest. Now, what could help the Imperium are the quarter billion Capellans. Many of them would probably have been grateful for the Vasudans' efforts in defending their homes. Perhaps as these Terrans settle in "convenient" places such as Sirius, these systems could become something of a vassal to them in the future.

 

Offline darkdaej

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory

In my admittedly simplistic view, I've thought of the system of government as being Security Council>Terran+Vasudan, General Assembly>Terran and Vasudan Imperium (self-explanatory). Khonsu II would still probably be the most powerful person in the GTVA, since he would be the representative of an entire species and as emperor would have the final say in many Vasudan matters.

That's what I always assumed, but reading through the lore entries and playing the games, I have a feeling this may not be the case.  As for the others saying the GTVA acts like the UN or something, I beg to differ.  While every planet might have some level of autonomy, the GTVA is, as stated by Petrarch, "The supreme authority in Terran-Vasudan space".  This means the laws enacted are to be followed by all "member planets".  We don't know if the fringes of space actually has Terran or Vasudan factions outside the GTVA, but one thing is certain - the Alliance is a firm government, not some ineffectual entity where all nations (read: planets) have a voice and aren't necessarily bound by their edicts.

Given that Sirius borders both Deneb and Alpha Centauri, the NTF have always been in a position to cut off the Vasudans and to bombard their major colonies (ex: Cygnus Prime). As far as we know, their are only 5 "Vasudan" systems; two of which are under attack and the two more at risk of being cut off. This alone would see the Vasudans take on the lion's share of the fighting in that region.

I do agree the Vasudans took quite a few hits there and I may have forgotten about that :P  However it seems that in if there was a conspiracy, Khonsu might be tempted to let Vasudans suffer at human hands to increase resentment towards them.  And of course, the Terrans fighting amongst themselves is obviously a plus.

4: Orpheus and Nightmare raise good points. The Vasudans definetly suffered more losses then just errant cruisers. I agree with your bloody nose vs intensive care result.

True, they lost more than a few Cruisers (the Psamtik comes to mind) but regardless, Terrans took a lot more damage than Vasudans during the Shivans' return.


In the aftermath of Capella, I'd think that any plans for a Vasudan takeover would have been scrapped at least temporarily. As Petrarch states during the final mission, the allied fleet had been "pulverized", so maintaining security over their colonies and standing-by to intercept any new Shivan incursion with what remains of their battlegroups would probably be in the Vasudans primary interest. Now, what could help the Imperium are the quarter billion Capellans. Many of them would probably have been grateful for the Vasudans' efforts in defending their homes. Perhaps as these Terrans settle in "convenient" places such as Sirius, these systems could become something of a vassal to them in the future.


True, the shivans definitely threw a spanner in the works, but it could be far worse...Maybe Khonsu will have to wait a decade or two longer than he'd hoped, but the Vasudans are a patient people.

 

Offline darkdaej

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
First, mind if I take some of it for the background materials on the NTF in The Lost Generation - Ashcroft, up to verbatim quotes? I have some in-universe conspiracy theories already in play but since one of the most insidious aspects of consipracy theories is that they can be quite à la carte, more is always better :D

Sure, just give me appropriate credits  :D  I'm interested in knowing which quotes you plan on taking.  Also if you need a writer, I guess I could help - I have some talent in that field :P

Now on to the objections:

1) Your analogy of the GTVA to a national government is flawed. It actually mirrors the structure of the UN, the main bodies of which are the General Assembly (where each UN member state has a seat and a vote) and the Security Council (which has a number of permanent and temporary members; with the permanent members holding a veto power against any resoultion brought before the body).

It mirrors it in structure, yes, but not in how it actually runs.  If the UN had the power the GTVA has, member nations wouldn't really be nations anymore.  I'd compare the GTVA to the EU (a frightening thought) more than the UN.  Let's just hope the laws aren't enacted by unelected bureaucrats like in the EU...
2) There is no evidence what the Vasudan Imperium actually is - but considering that there are able paralells between the PVN and the popular conception of the Japanse Naval forces in WW2, it is not beyond possibility that the Vasudan Imperium simply is meant to be something like Japan's Imperial Household Agency.

Hmm, how is that an objection to my points?

3) You picture of the NTF rebellion is based on a limited information falacy. Canonically, you are playing a terran pilot on the Acquitance, which appears to be acting in rapid response capacity rather than to engage in prolonged fighting of any kind - that appears to be job of more local units, such as the 11th or 13th Vasudan Battlegroups . Since the information you are given during any given briefing is limited to your current posting, you cannot infer from that what other units are doing unless a Command Briefing comes and expands on the events, e.g the CB for The Sixth Wonder mentions a failed campaign against Sirius.

4) As related to 3, the Mission Briefing for Into the Maelstrom, points out that relations are strained which lead to an active seperation of terran and vasudan units in the field.

I'm aware we lack critical information given our point of view in the game.  But at the same time, I think :V: gave the information they wanted the player to have.  The Aquitaine isn't a rapid response ship even though that's how it often seems.  It's the flagship of the 3rd fleet, based in Capella.  They'll be deployed to nearby theaters in cases of need, but they're supposed to be patrolling Capella and its outlying areas when not at war.  It is true that we can't infer what's going on elsewhere, but I'm operating with what we know here :)

6) If the Vasudans were holding back, why deploy the Memphis (see Straight, No Chaser), the Psamtik (see Fog of War and onwards) and the Toeris (see Speaking in Tongues) to the Nebula? - That's a significant committment, esspecially since in the CB of Battle of the Wilderness it is stated that destruction of Ravana did not suppress Shivan activity in the Nebula but it intensified in response to the loss of the Ravana.

The 13th Battlegroup had been deployed.  I'm guessing, but it's likely those three destroyers were the major capital ships of that battlegroup, so it's not like additional deployment was done.  Now, as for why the Vasudans made the push in the nebula?  One reason would be for "balance", given that the Terrans just lost significant resources against both the Shivans and the NTF, it's the Vasudans' turn on the wheel.  Another reason would be because they'd be more than happy to get their hands on Bosch BEFORE the Terrans do. 

 

Offline 0rph3u5

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
The Aquitaine isn't a rapid response ship even though that's how it often seems.  It's the flagship of the 3rd fleet, based in Capella.  They'll be deployed to nearby theaters in cases of need, but they're supposed to be patrolling Capella and its outlying areas when not at war.

It is true that the Aquitaine (spelled correctly this time) is not a dedicated rapid response unit, but throughout the FS2 campaign it is deployed like one. That is not contradictory to it being the flagship of the 3rd Fleet or being permanently stationed in Capella.

It's like real world state deploying ships for a multilateral mission, e.g. EU NAVFOR Somalia.

1) Your analogy of the GTVA to a national government is flawed. It actually mirrors the structure of the UN, the main bodies of which are the General Assembly (where each UN member state has a seat and a vote) and the Security Council (which has a number of permanent and temporary members; with the permanent members holding a veto power against any resoultion brought before the body).

It mirrors it in structure, yes, but not in how it actually runs.  If the UN had the power the GTVA has, member nations wouldn't really be nations anymore.  I'd compare the GTVA to the EU (a frightening thought) more than the UN.

The intel entry (Species.tbl) for the GTVA give us the following:
Quote
This treaty organization recognized the autonomy of its constituents as it provided a framework for trade and mutual defense.
[...]
BETAC dismantled the governments of the Terran blocs and recognized the General Assembly, the Security Council, and the Vasudan Imperium as the supreme authorities of Terran-Vasudan space.

Note that it says "supreme authority" not sole or absolute authority - there is no "L'etat c'est moi" in there. This suggests that are still structures of regional authority below the GTVA. The earlier part of the line about the disolution of the bloc-governments doesn't contradict this - esspecially since it is emphasised that there is a recognition of autonomy; the bloc-goverments may have simply been incompatible with the overarching framework, esspecially since the "Reconstruction"-entry mentions that the hegemony of pan-Terranism needed to be reestablished during the the Reconstruction:

Quote
With its economy in ruins and political structures in turmoil, the Galactic Terran Alliance disintegrated into semi-autonomous regional blocs, each with its own agenda. [...] the resumption of open commerce rekindled the notion of a pan-Terran community.

That the NTF is described as seeking "independence" in Surrender, Belisarius doesn't contradict this either; it is actually made clear that what they are seeking independence from are the BETAC structures. There is much daylight between autonomy and independence.

2) There is no evidence what the Vasudan Imperium actually is - but considering that there are able paralells between the PVN and the popular conception of the Japanse Naval forces in WW2, it is not beyond possibility that the Vasudan Imperium simply is meant to be something like Japan's Imperial Household Agency.
Hmm, how is that an objection to my points?

You are argument implied that the Vasudan Imperium is a co-equal branch of the GTVA. I would like to propose that if the GTVA has a structures of regional autonomy (see above), the Vasudan Imperium might serve a purpose other than policy making - it might very well just be a "palace office" for the Vasudan Emperor which has primarily the function to observe traditional protocoll is followed. With its station being elevated to an institution of the GTVA to put it above the political negotiations of the regional vasudan governments (historically the office of Emperor across cultures has been given a certain "divine quality" e.g. the Divine Right of European monarchs rooted in christianity or the Mandate of Heaven in China)

Of course a different view would be to equate it to the household of the Princeps in the Roman Empire... but there is little evidence to support that all the other materials on the Vasudans; the analogies to Japan and Imperial China are much stronger in the text.

The 13th Battlegroup had been deployed.  I'm guessing, but it's likely those three destroyers were the major capital ships of that battlegroup, so it's not like additional deployment was done.  Now, as for why the Vasudans made the push in the nebula?  One reason would be for "balance", given that the Terrans just lost significant resources against both the Shivans and the NTF, it's the Vasudans' turn on the wheel.  Another reason would be because they'd be more than happy to get their hands on Bosch BEFORE the Terrans do. 

a) The application of Ockham's Razor to the material suggest that the Vasudan forces simple became avalible after having been bound up in the fight against the NTF previously.

b) There is a limit of what you can deploy to theatre such as the Nebula, e.g. there are no planetary bodies (canonically) to land to troops on.


ps. I am so tempted to just empty out the script for Of Shivans and Men right now, because in writing that I went into detail on a version of how the Vasudan Monarchy works. Let's just say while Kvasi from Walking on Ashes/The Lost Generation - Jaarin might be an edge chase - I mean he is an honest to goodness cultist - I spend a good bit of time on idea that for Imperial Vasudans the Emperor is more than secular monarch.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2019, 03:30:02 am by 0rph3u5 »
"When you work with water, you have to know and respect it. When you labour to subdue it, you have to understand that one day it may rise up and turn all your labours into nothing. For what is water, which seeks to make all things level, which has no taste or colour of its own, but a liquid form of Nothing?" - Graham Swift, Waterland

"As you sought to steal a kingdom for yourself, so must you do again, a thousand times over. For a theft, a true theft, must be practiced to be earned." - The terms of Nysa's curse, Pathfinder: Kingmaker

"...because they are not Dragons."

 
Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
On the other hand Khonsu himself was credited for the economic and political recovery which implies that he still has considerable power.

 

Offline 0rph3u5

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
On the other hand Khonsu himself was credited for the economic and political recovery which implies that he still has considerable power.

Have a look at the timeline:

Quote
The Vasudans were governed by a Parliament until 2339, when the Vasudan Emperor, Khonsu II, dissolved this body and formed a new government

Quote
The Galactic Terran-Vasudan Alliance (GTVA) was formed in 2345.

Note that after that the hard power decisions of the GTVA are made the Security Council. The economic and cultural recovery of the Vasudans is credited to Khonsu but that doesn't need to be a hard power affair. It can easily be done through soft power alone, which doesn't require an involvement day-to-day policy affairs. Various states have their heads of state only be figureheads to inspire the citizens and represent the professed ideals of the state. (Now of course there are also state that don't seperate the head of state form the head of government.... with predictable results....)
« Last Edit: August 08, 2019, 04:53:13 am by 0rph3u5 »
"When you work with water, you have to know and respect it. When you labour to subdue it, you have to understand that one day it may rise up and turn all your labours into nothing. For what is water, which seeks to make all things level, which has no taste or colour of its own, but a liquid form of Nothing?" - Graham Swift, Waterland

"As you sought to steal a kingdom for yourself, so must you do again, a thousand times over. For a theft, a true theft, must be practiced to be earned." - The terms of Nysa's curse, Pathfinder: Kingmaker

"...because they are not Dragons."

 
Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
Not impossible - as I said before the Vasudans probably had more industry in their colonies (which the GTVA was made of).

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
I think it’s an awesome idea. I haven’t really seen this explored before.

 

Offline Colt

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
Not impossible - as I said before the Vasudans probably had more industry in their colonies (which the GTVA was made of).
Vasuda Prime's probably a pretty good source for mining now, right?

 
Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
There should be mining sites everywhere; the Vasudans could use them money generated by their superior economy to buy mines in "Terran" GTVA space which AFAIK is much larger.

 

Offline darkdaej

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
Not impossible - as I said before the Vasudans probably had more industry in their colonies (which the GTVA was made of).
Vasuda Prime's probably a pretty good source for mining now, right?

Depends how high the radiation is, I guess...

 
Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
I would presume they have tech to handle that, I mean GTVA uses depleted uranium as armor on some ships...

 

Offline darkdaej

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Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
Here's another point to bring forward for this conspiracy.


The GTVA Colossus :

This jointly-developped boondogle also reeks of Vasudan political meddling.  Here’s how I see it.  Assume that my proposed form of government is how the GTVA is set up (there’s no canon proof for or against… from what I can tell)
1: Khonsu II officially proposes a joint project to the GTVA General Assembly via the Vasudan Imperium:  Build a ship that could, with the current wave of technological advance, wipe out a Shivan Lucifer should one make an appearance.

2: After much political lobbying in the Assembly, the project sees approval.  Terran demands include a majority share for tenders and most contractors are Terran (The Colossus propaganda piece cites only one major Vasudan contractor and mentions it last).  The crew would be mixed, but the ship’s first captain would be Terran.  Vasudan representatives object for a time, but cave in to Terran demands.  Vasudan government spin doctors use the “Economic reconstruction trumps ego” line to sell the project to its own people.

3: The Colossus is built.  However as Khonsu had planned all along knowing this would amount to little more than a PR boondoggle, the Terrans overspent and their economy actually gets bogged down with production of that “monstrosity” to quote Rear Admiral Koth.  Vasudan stock exchanges make great gains while Triton Dynamics and Subach-Innes, the biggest military contractors the Terrans have, stagnate due to an inability to respond to demand for other projects, such as weapon systems and fighters.
4: Thanks to some corporate espionage during development, Mekhu enterprises reverse-engineer the Subach HL-7 and create an arguably superior variant for Vasudans.  Subach sues Mekhu for copyright infringement.  Mekhu wins on a technicality due to the slight differences in power, ROF, etc.  Also helps that the 3-judge panel was majority Vasudan (via Khonsu’s influence).  This decision occurs a few years before the emergence of the NTF and acts as one of the Anti-Vasudan arguments it put forward.
All in all, the Colossus was a great way to both undermine the Terran economy and military production abilities, while at the same time increasing Vasudan political clout.




 
Re: Vasudan takeover - a theory
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3: The Colossus is built.  However as Khonsu had planned all along knowing this would amount to little more than a PR boondoggle, the Terrans overspent and their economy actually gets bogged down with production of that “monstrosity” to quote Rear Admiral Koth.  Vasudan stock exchanges make great gains while Triton Dynamics and Subach-Innes, the biggest military contractors the Terrans have, stagnate due to an inability to respond to demand for other projects, such as weapon systems and fighters.

I don't think the Terran companies were effected, as their ships aren't inferior to the Vasudan ones. Regarding 4, it's an interesting take, but I don't see that much hint for that - though economic espionage certainly should be a thing.

However I really like this economic approach to FS lore, most discussions here go like "Thing X happend, than Thing Y so this might have happened"; however my take is that things like the "Vasudan economic miracle" don't happen out of the blue sky.