[Lightspeed]

I'll redo one of them these days as to show the difference.

[Taristin]

Do miner02vtile03

[Lightspeed]

Hmm.... if you could turn your "crash your PC for free" model of it into something actually playable I would consider doing hi-res textures for it.

[DaBrain]

Originally posted by Lightspeed
The retail one.

Actually, I did a little experiment since my last post. It took me exactly 1:30 minutes to be precise.



Guess what this is?

No, its not your image.

I did the following:

• open the retail graphic in Photoshop
• resize it to double size
• add a texturizing filter (Relief: 1, Size: 100%, texture 'brick')
• Contrast +22, Brightness -16

Now, compare that to your image:



Shocking how identical they look isnt it?

And I just ran three filters over it. Granted, your version boosts the contrast a bit more even, but its hard to find your exact settings.

-edit: to do proper high res maps the maps will have to be rebuilt completely - I could probably try to  get one map done to show what I mean. Resizing and applying filters really isnt the way to upgrade anything at all. [/B]

That's nowhere near my texture. Sorry, but it looks much more grainy, less smooth, yet less sharp (look at the signs, or rust on the hull). Also you messed up the colors. I see much too blue spots. And you used the texturizer on the whole image, not just on certain areas. The shading is also bad. I can't see a single real black area and no highlighs on the other side.

This is a bad first step. Now the real work would have to follow.



This is what you see ingame when you get near the ship. This is important.

[Liberator]

If you do the right one LS, you'd nail a bunch of ships without trying hard.

[Taristin]

Originally posted by Lightspeed
Hmm.... if you could turn your "crash your PC for free" model of it into something actually playable I would consider doing hi-res textures for it.

Really? You're uber PC couldn't handle it? My weak GF2 looved it.

Anyway, I've been considerring smoothening it out, but I've been so lazy about actually lining everything back up, and doing the proper poffing... That and I have to make a bullet. And give some ships the 'Nico effect.' And work on my Little T... Meh code talk is hard...

[J3Vr6]

Well this was fun.  So it's been concluded that they would have to be done from scratch?  Lightspeed, when do you think you'll have time to do that example with just one of them?  I'm sure we'd all like to see it.

[DaBrain]

@LS To be honest I would even use this one over the stock one. (Well perhaps blur it better before )



Beacause it has more detail. I think brick fits to the style map. You overdid it, but even tough it's better then the old one.
That's because of the limitation in colors and size(due to computerspeed at that time). Tho stock ones look to drawed. They miss rust, shading and scratches. This is what makes them feel more realistic.

And if you create a new texture don't forget that the most people don't want too different things. (This is what makes it this difficult)

Originally posted by Flipside
... you need to rebuild the entire texture, and doing all of them would be an utter nightmare

That's the problem. There is nobody who want to do this.
And even if sombody would do it, it cost so much time that there might be nobody who is still interessted in them, when they are finished...

Originally posted by Flipside
I agree with you there Lightspeed, you cannot 'create' detail, ...

You can. Using texturizer is ok. They don't really create detail, but if used right, they can give the map a more realistic look.  
The orion map here was propably intended to look dirty, as you can see (the black rusty thing). Why not sharpen it a bit and add a bit too ?
And if we are at it, lets redraw all the lines, to make them draker and sharper. Because those are the things which look most ugly ingame if you get near them.
(The stuckture on it is not just "bricks" )

[jdjtcagle]

Originally posted by DaBrain
it cost so much time that there might be nobody who is still interessted in them, when they are finished...

 

Umm... No, but there are not very many people willing to do this

[Lightspeed]

Originally posted by DaBrain


That's nowhere near my texture. Sorry, but it looks much more grainy, less smooth, yet less sharp (look at the signs, or rust on the hull). Also you messed up the colors. I see much too blue spots. And you used the texturizer on the whole image, not just on certain areas. The shading is also bad. I can't see a single real black area and no highlighs on the other side.

This is a bad first step. Now the real work would have to follow.

This is what you see ingame when you get near the ship. This is important.

Thats cause you applied a 'sharpen' to the image first.

Sorry to say but you didnt do ANYTHING but apply standard filters to the map.

@raa: I never tried it since you said its around 14k polygons. I'd accept 6k at most.

@j3vr6: yes, they would have to be redone from scratch. I think I could possibly throw together an example in one day (i.e. tomorrow) if I get enough time to work on it. I'll have to see what life has prepared for me.

@upgrading textures: I had planned to make hi-res textures of all FS2 textures - but it is scheduled for after my nebula and weapon effects, so its gonna be a while till you will see any of that. While it does take a while to properly upgrade the textures it is no excuse to make cheap and dirty hi res ones where the only thing they do is drain lots of performance and look just as bad or even worse than the stock ones.

I remember people going 'who will ever take the time to make all shinemaps - thats soooo much we wont make it if its not gonna be a community effort'. And I finished those off in a few months. Go figure.

Of course jobs like that look like a huge thing to accomplish in the first place. But it isn't too bad if you slowly do it step by step and look at what you have already done, instead at what lies ahead of you.

[DaBrain]

Originally posted by Lightspeed


Thats cause you applied a 'sharpen' to the image first.

Sorry to say but you didnt do ANYTHING but apply standard filters to the map.

"Sharpen" doesn't help much. And don't tell me that's the only difference between our maps. But I'm pretty sure you know that.

And just by looking at it you should be able to see there is much more in it then only some filters. By just using texturizers you will never reach anything. (Neither as by using the standard lensflares, as some newbies think)

It will take quite some time until your map reaches mine...
Especialy because grainy maps will cause heavy aliasing. But you know that either.

So why criticize my map ?

Perhaps you don't understand it. If it takes 2 hours to create a map, you will never see more then 10 new maps.

Even if you create a complete new one that won't change. And it's pointless too.

Let's concentrate on something that can really be done. There will be something better all the time, perfectionism won't help.




Edit: Shinemaps are only standard maps, with the dark areas cut out. That can be done without even using one painting tool.

New textures are something different.

[ShadowDrakken]

you know, if someone were willing to pull the textures out one at a time and feed them to me, I bet I could spit them back out at a higher res with more detail w/o losing the original design of the texture and I'd be happy to do it too, looks like it'd be a fun challenge.

But that's the catch, someone else has to pull the texture and give it to me, then recompile the textures as I finish the high res I'll do the art if someone else does the work, lol =^_^=

[Drew]

honstly LS, from here it looks like you just dont like him taking some of the attention away from you as photoshop texture redo god. Gezuz, even i can recognize thats a little more than just a few filters in place. Give the man some props dammit....

[Unknown Target]

Really, those textures look like they just had some filters run over them. I suck at texture manipulation in PS, and even I think that.
And if they're more than that, well, they should look like they're more than that, shouldn't they?

[ShadowDrakken]

I agree with Unknown Target.  To me both look like just filter jobs, no real work to them, and the brick pattern on both just looks horrible as a flat image, I can only imagine how they look in game

As I said before, I would be perfectly willing to redo all the original art in a larger size, from scratch, keeping the same designs so it just gained detail, if someone else is willing to coordinate the work.  I imagine I could fix up a texture every day or two (at WORST one a week, but I doubt I'll get that far behind)

[DaBrain]

Originally posted by Drew
honstly LS, from here it looks like you just dont like him taking some of the attention away from you as photoshop texture redo god. Gezuz, even i can recognize thats a little more than just a few filters in place. Give the man some props dammit....

I'm starting to think that too.

LS you didn't even give a singe constructive advice (And that is the reason I opend this for).

You seem hate work that isn't done by yourself.

And this is not the first time you didn't post anything constructive...

Originally posted by Lightspeed
I still think they look like the originals with messed up colour.

Except for the afterburner trail of course, which IMHO looks crappy as it's cut off and obviously flat, as can be seen in this picture:

Originally posted by Lightspeed
Call me a moron, but I prefer the stock effects.

And with your influence (You are somewhat known here), you not only make the people stop giving me positve feedback, but to stop them giving me any real feedback at all.
(Afterwards you steal my ideas and try to copy what I did.)

Originally posted by Lightspeed
You've inspired me to play around a bit with explosions...

Lightspeeds high-explosive compilation™

Includes the following:

• High Res ANIs (from FS1 and FS2)
• LODs for explosions removed for clearer distance views
• New flak explosion (from FS1)
• Smooth Explosion Technique™ (15 FPS explosions looked a bit stuttery)

Try it [/B]

First you told me that even the idea is bad (without saying anything constructive), then you copied it, but you never admited that it's a good idea. Seems to be rather unfair.

[ShadowDrakken]

you 2 done with the piss fight?

I like this whole idea of a high res texture pack, and I'm even willing to redo some textures myself.  But I agree that they need to be redone from scratch and that's gonna take a bit of time.  But I'm up for the challenge anyway if you 2 will stop fighting, just ignore each other and lets get something a little more serious done already, good grief!

[kasperl]

jesus.

aside from the blaming eachother of IP theft, can we please take a look at the problem at hand?

filtering texes won't help. i played around enough with PSP (similar enough to PS) to learn that. someone will have to redo it, either with a paint brush or something, or with a tablet.


and as for Ls not offering constructive advice, he simply said that this method won't work, whatever way you play with it.

and the thing he whipped up, the original, and your work, it's mostly the original that wins. the brick thingy, while perhaps realisitc, doesn't do it. if we want realism, we would be seeing large black boxes firing invisible beams at eachother while passing at gigantic distances at high speeds.

[DaBrain]

Originally posted by kasperl
jesus.
filtering texes won't help. i played around enough with PSP (similar enough to PS) to learn that.

That's perfectly right, and I never said anything else.

But as there are a few people who like this, it would be a good idea if this continues under the aspect of my first posting (What should be changed ?).

[ShadowDrakken]

DaBrain:
I don't think simple textures or texture-like effects is the right way to go, because you're not really adding anything that will be visible in game under most circumstances.  I think redrawing the textures using the originals as a template would be far more effective, allowing for greater detail and clarity.

That's my suggestion