Author Topic: Ship size and role in the FS universe.  (Read 38517 times)

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Offline NGTM-1R

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
Not necessarily. The Shivans, you'll notice, do it all the time and pretty much without warning.

The jump doesn't really have to be that close, either. With 1 kilometer will do nicely. Even 2km will be close enough. And the mass of the carrier itself will screen you from a significant portion of the escorts.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2004, 04:18:42 am by 2191 »
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Offline karajorma

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
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Originally posted by Swamp_Thing
Fourth, i am a fierce apologist of "attack is the best defense". The carrier would never get caught in a defensive situation, because it would be used ofensively. It would detect any possible targets, launch the fighters and bombers wich in turn would make a small in-system jump, and take on the destroyer


This is laughable. How are you going to attack other systems which are being sensible enough to blockade the node? Your carrier fleet would be ripped apart if they tried it. You simply can't launch enough ships with intersystem jump drives to exert the one advantage a carrier does have over the enemy.
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Offline Singh

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
unless you launched them in subspace and had them pop out ahead of ya.

Seriously though; Destroyers have their uses, and are ub3r under certain circumstances, and the same goes for Carriers. No need to keep on arguing about it ya know :P
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
Nodes are FS choke points. Choke points are where the targets are. Aside from the ease of defending that lone point in space rather then multiple targets spread across a system, you can be assured that you will have something to shoot at when blockading a node, instead of having to cruise around for hours trying to find a target.
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Offline karajorma

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Originally posted by Singh
unless you launched them in subspace and had them pop out ahead of ya.


Wouldn't work. They still wouldn't be able to jump out of the subspace corridor. All you'd have succeeded in doing is leaving your fighters behind when you jumped into the system :D

Quote
Originally posted by Singh
Seriously though; Destroyers have their uses, and are ub3r under certain circumstances, and the same goes for Carriers. No need to keep on arguing about it ya know :P


Exactly. I've never said carriers are bad. They are very useful in the right circumstances but they are not a replacement for the destroyer and I'm getting sick of seeing people use wet navy logic to justify that they are.
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Offline Zarax

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
If you need to breach a blockade a carrier is the last thing that should enter...
Carriers are meant for fleet support duties rather than direct fighting... You would at least need to send the whole escort fleet ahead if you hope to breach a blockade...
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Offline karajorma

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Originally posted by Zarax
If you need to breach a blockade a carrier is the last thing that should enter...
Carriers are meant for fleet support duties rather than direct fighting... You would at least need to send the whole escort fleet ahead if you hope to breach a blockade...


Even doing that you'd have the entire escort fleet fighting a similar or larger enemy force with limited fighter support.

Storming an enemy node is very hard but to attempt to do it without enough fighter support is just suicide.
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Offline Zarax

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Well, that tactic would at least give the carrier a chance to jump in and launch a sizeable number of fighters...
And of course siege rules are always valid...
If you are attacking a fortified position with similar tech you need numerical superiority...
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Offline karajorma

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Originally posted by Zarax
Well, that tactic would at least give the carrier a chance to jump in and launch a sizeable number of fighters...


I agree that if you're going to attack a node using a carrier this is probably the best tactic.

Doesn't change the fact that the whole idea of attacking a blockade with a carrier based fleet instead of a destroyer based one is a stupid idea in the first place :D
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Offline Zarax

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
I'm a simple pilot, i do not question Command decisions ;)
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Offline TrashMan

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
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Originally posted by Swamp_Thing


Sorry, but that is wrong. Cruisers are fast, not slow. A cruiser has a top speed of 30+ knots, while a battleship can reach 25, tops. The "cruiser" expression was first made to represent a fast moving vessel, that could "cruise" the oceans stalking its prey, usually heavier and slower battleships.
Destroyers are even faster, with speeds of up to 35 knots or more (the navy never discloses their top speed).
Generally speaking, "cruise" means the average or usual speed at wich a vessel travels, i.e "cruise control", "cruising speed".
It is usually wrongly associated to the expression "cruise liner", wich is a heavy, slow moving passenger ship. There is nothing slow about a navy cruiser, it´s built for speed and firepower.
With the advent of rockets and guided missiles, the cruiser was set aside, and the new type of cruiser/destroyer emerged, the Aegis cruiser. It´s the size of a destroyer, but carries the punch of a cruiser. It is also more focused as an anti-aircraft triple-A platform for aerial warfare, while the destroyer is more focused in submarine warfare.
The battleship itself hasn´t disappeared yet, from modern navy. Allthough the US scuttled its big battleships in exchange for carriers, there are still other countries that maintain them in active duty. Not for much longer, i´ll grant you that...
The carrier is the wave of the future. One carrier can obliterate an entire fleet of battleships, without even setting eyes on them.
The same would and will happen in space.


Well yes, cruise isn't really slow. Cruiser were actually fast for their size, and they combined speed with firepower, alltough they really couldn't counter a battleship.
In Fs2 terms, no ship calss is obsolete - the FS2 destroyer, a carrier or a battleship. They would just have different duties.

Carriers would have a freaking huge number of fighter/bombers - surely twice that of a destroyer. Given the power of fighter/bombers in FS2, that is a power indeed. However, it's weak hull and shielding and low firepower would limit it to support roles, acting more as mobile fighterbases and less as front-line warships. Thus they wouldn't be used for blockades or direct assault, but would be kept in the rear to swarm the enemy.
they would be very usefull in guarding home systems, since their speed and large number of wings can cover a lot of are for partoling.

Battleship would be all armor and firepower - no fightercapacity whatsoever. Since no other warship can match it's abitiy to dish out and take punishment, it would allways be in the front lines. Naturaly, given the fact that it is designed to stand alone, it AA armament would be terifiyng indeed, alltough it would still require help from smaller warship dedicated to fighterdefense in case of a large assault.

FS2 Destroyers (Cruisers by my book) are a blend of those two. They can't matck a battleship in armor or firepowr, nor can they match the carrier in fightercapacity, but they would still be a valubale unit.  Having the power to defend themselves and beeing resilliant, while still carrying enough bombers/fighters to cause havoc if used correctly, they would also be in the fron lines and would be very usefull at blockading nodes.

Naturally ships should move in battlegroups. No stupid missions in which a single(important) warship is sent to dangerous missions. There should allways be escorts.

Naturally, such a fleet setup creates a interesting battlefield. A constant game of cat and mouse where the hunter and the hunted constantly change, depending on the fleets.
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Offline Ghostavo

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
*sighs*

I've already proven that a carrier the same size of a destroyer would not carry ub3r m1ll10ns fighters/bombers... meh... :sigh:
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Offline aldo_14

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
It's all sodding arbitray anyways.  I could build a carrier 2km long that had 5 bfgreens and 2000 fighters, and use some techno-babble-****e to explain it.  And it'd be no less valid than this 'ere thread.

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
...like storing the fighters in Plothole-space?
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Offline Zarax

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No, just use onboard replicators... Unfortunately they does not work on Alpha1...
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
That'd be fortunately.

Otherwise, the GTVA would have laughed at the Sathanas fleet and blown them all away. Then hunted down what's left of the Shivans and had a pool party to celebrated the annihilation of the Shivan race.
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Offline Zarax

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Well, with the promising breakthroughs in nanotechnology that wouldn't be unrealistic...
You use zillions of nanobots to build fleets, with crews and raw materials being the only limit...
Hey, that would be a good explanation for Shivan numerical superiority too (nanotech + large scale cloning/eugenetics)...
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Offline aldo_14

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Originally posted by ngtm1r
...like storing the fighters in Plothole-space?


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Offline Mongoose

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
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Originally posted by aldo_14


and powered by a Technobabble reactor

No, by an Improbability Drive! :p

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Ship size and role in the FS universe.
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