[Warlock]

All I was saying...and not directed at any in the thread.,..just in general,...was of the folks that do belive it's a sin, bad, evil, or even just poor taste,..do tend to attempt pushing that belief upon others.

[Carl]

there are several reasons not to have pre-marital sex, even if you are in a relationship.

1. if you have a kid, he or she won't have both a father and a mother living together which is all but essential if you want your kid to grow up normal. and if you are gonna live together then why not just get married?

2. you might get (or give) an STD. are you gonna ask him or her to go get tested during the spur of the moment?

Bob walks in and grabs Bobbet by the waist, wresting her to the ground. They both laugh, then start kissing, then Bob looks deeply into Bobbet's eyes and says..."Let's get tested for aids." yeah right  

3. your a slut!  
or at least it might seem that way to some people, maybe even to you're spouse or possibly even you.

4. what if you break up? maybe the next person won't want to get serious because you've already had it?

5. you're family might not approve. you might say to yourself "it doesn't matter what anybody else thinks!" but come on, you know it does.

6. YOU'RE A SLUT!!!! YOU WHORE!!!!    

[This message has been edited by Carl (edited 01-19-2002).]

[Carl]

 

Originally posted by Zeronet:
I dont think its a mortal sin, so if you do, do it, it wont condemn you to hell.

umm...every sin condemns you to hell. if you steal a peice of candy from your little brother, you're going to hell. why? because heaven requires 100% perfectness. would you drink a glass of water if it had just one tiny drop of cyanide in it?

[Thorn]

 

Originally posted by Carl:
6. YOU'RE A SLUT!!!! YOU WHORE!!!!      

You say that like its a bad thing  

[an0n]

Premarital sex is fine by me as long as it's with a member of the opposite sex and it's a human (/same species).

As for the religion thing, I sugggest you peeps sit down and actually read your respective holy books. The bible is full of all sorts of **** :
If you sleep with a girl you MUST marry her, but if her father refuses to let you then you must pay him.
You can stone homosexuals to death (really, it's not a sin)
I even think there's something in there about not f-ing your ox.

But if you don't have time, just read the book of Job and you'll see how petty and smug God is.

[an0n]

 

Bob walks in and grabs Bobbet by the waist, wresting her to the ground. They both laugh, then start kissing, then Bob looks deeply into Bobbet's eyes and says..."Let's get tested for aids." yeah right

I did something along those lines. It didn't go down too well.

[Shrike]

Keep it civil people.  

[Carl]

 

[Carl]

 

Originally posted by an0n:
If you sleep with a girl you MUST marry her, but if her father refuses to let you then you must pay him.

You can stone homosexuals to death (really, it's not a sin)
I even think there's something in there about not f-ing your ox.

But if you don't have time, just read the book of Job and you'll see how petty and smug God is.

you pay the father compensation for defiling his daughter. it doesn't make it no longer a sin if you pay.'

you can't just start throwing rocks at gay people. in olden times it was a method of capital punishment.

and Job got all his stuff back and more.

besides, all those laws were part of the old covenent.

[an0n]

I didn't bother to read the new testament. The whole Jesus thing sounds like a pile of ****  to me. I prefered the vengeful, angry God in the Old Testament.

I think the Bible is pretty much just a compendium of sci-fi stories that were grouped together coz they all featured God. I mean all that stuff about the Valley of Death sounds soooo like a ship to me. And the burning stuff that doesn't burn could easily be a holographic system. Not that I'm a scientologist or anything (Travolta sucks).

And I do realise that someone will probably say that I've got things the wrong way round and sci-fi was influenceed by the Bible yada yada yada......

And about the gay people thing: If you stoned one to death and were taken to trial I'd bet my ***  that when you testified they'd make you swear on the very same bible that told you to do it in the first place.

[Carl]

hey, that's a good way to get out of it  

[Warlock]

You know the one thing ppl forget about??

The entire christian relegion is based off a a book written by a person about a supernatural being. All well and good...but do not forget the "Written by a person", ie man/woman NORMAL not God or Christ himself.


I've yet to meet a man or woman that was not at least slightly bias to lend towards personal beliefs.

Thus the word of God,...written by man, would most likely be a tad bit ...embelished we'll say.


But what the hey   If premarital sex leads me to hell...least I'll be warm and won't have those damned harps all over the place    (joking)

[Thorn]

You know, Ive been thinking about this, and Ive decided, its none of your damn business what two consenting people do together...

[CP5670]

This topic is really getting huge...

Anyway since everyone is voicing out their full opinion on religion, I might as well do the same. I think the whole concept of religion was originally conceived for two reasons, one of which was to bring about a general order and law into civilizations. People obeyed these "laws" pretty much out of fear for their god. The other purpose of religion was to explain the natural phenomena that science could not.

We as a species have progressed a good deal since then, and religion has served its purpose in my opinion and is no longer of any use. Governments now take up the position that was once filled by god in the minds of people (obedience to a set of laws and fear of punishment when they are not adhered to), and science has come a very long way since the original religious texts were written. (it was earlier accepted that god created the universe, now the big bang has taken up the place)

Also, most religions I have seen seem to have a general inflexibility to the changing of times that has caused problems over the years, and more lives have been lost over religious arguments than any other issue I can think of. For example, there is a lot of nonsense in the Bible (or any other religious text, for that matter) which can be interpreted in almost an infinite number of different ways. (none of which have any material backing or trustworthy historical evidence for their truth)

(lol I could go on for hours on philosophy)

However, everyone has his her own views upon the matter, and I hold nothing against people who feel different from me.

Sex is still stupid though.

 

It's not supposed to be an intellectual pursuit, CP. MAybe that's the problem here...  

so um, what's the point of it?

 

You know, Ive been thinking about this, and Ive decided, its none of your damn business what two consenting people do together...

I agree with that; as long as it does not disturb the peace of others people should be allowed to do pretty much whatever they want.

[Warlock]

Next we'll be quoting Bill Cliton's definition of sexual  

Since each relegion has it's own "you can do it at THIS time but only in THIS manner/style"

So I propose this...if you think sex ouot of marriage is bad...what about in different "manners" (no not 'gay') than the Bible or whatever you're 'book of god' may be (Sorry I don't know the title to each religion's book,..forgive the ignorance, it's not disrespect.)

[an0n]

Koran (quoran?)
Torah
Bible
Guru Granth Sahib (sp?)
...are the main ones.

And if God created man in his own image then we're all perfect right?

If sex before marriage was a sin then all those people who were around before the bible and its definition of marriage are screwed (figuratively and literally).

[Warlock]

Actually on that accord,..I guess Adam and Eve REALLY pissed off the old man eh? There was no concept of marriage then and if you add in the idea that they're the mother and father of mankind,...well...at a sin per session...one enterity in hell each....well you get the point  

[IceFire]

Wow, this is a hot topic now.

The key thing with this discussion is that everyone continues to respect the decisions, beliefs and opinions of others.  So thats my first opinion on premarital sex.  So I say its absolutely alright for others to engage in such activity.  I would hope they would be careful, reasonable, and smart about it, but I know that some won't and so whats the point in arguing.

As for myself, I don't think I can say yes or no but the most important point would be that the person would have to be very very special to me.

[Martinus]

 

Originally posted by an0n:
Koran (quoran?)
Torah
Bible
Guru Granth Sahib (sp?)
...are the main ones.

And if God created man in his own image then we're all perfect right?

If sex before marriage was a sin then all those people who were around before the bible and its definition of marriage are screwed (figuratively and literally).

Religion is always a volitile subject. It comes down to the simple fact that humans require a set of beliefs to live life. To tell someone that what they believe is wrong is to take the foundation of their perception of everything around them and claim it's bullsh1t. It's hard enough to make sense of life without someone telling you that everything you believe is wrong.

I'm probably a weirdo, I constructed my belief system out of aspects of catholisim, christianity, jedi-isim (yep you read that right even if it isn't really a word), science and a few drops of blind faith.
I try to do the right thing, I try to help people without expecting reward and I'd give my life for the people I love. In short I treat people the way I hope they'll treat me.
Oh and I believe in God, God exists and nothing you can tell me to the contrary will ever make me believe any different. If you come up with some scientific proof that God cannot exist I'll still believe in him/her/it.

In all of this I always keep one thing in mind, I'm not right, I'm only right for me and I'll never tell anyone that they are wrong because that invalidates my right to believe what I want to.

So to actually get round to sticking this mumbo jumbo in context with this discussion I think premarital sex is OK if you believe it is the right (moral?) thing to do...

[This message has been edited by Maeglamor (edited 01-19-2002).]

[jonskowitz]

 

Originally posted by an0n:
And if God created man in his own image then we're all perfect right?

*sigh*  If you'd blow the dust off of that old black book you're grandmother gave you and actually read the first chapter or two then you'd know that when created, we were perfect.  Our fall from grace was orchistrated by 'the North Star' (you get a cookie if you can figure that reference out) and we became imperfect beings when we disobeyed god's command and consumed the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

 

If sex before marriage was a sin then all those people who were around before the bible and its definition of marriage are screwed (figuratively and literally).

Once again, you're guilty of not knowing what you're talking about.  The act of sex consummates a marriage, it is what creates it, not the exchange of vows or all the other silvery trappings the secular world has attached to it (although to be legally recognized within the US it does need to be witnessed by the appropriate officials  )