Author Topic: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?  (Read 38352 times)

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Offline Sarafan

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?

Well, the player can prevent that massacre. This means that it shouldn't be considered. There are some glitches, like the Colossus that sustains moderate damage even if you disarm the Sathanas' main beam weapons in Bearbaiting. Again, we can't be sure :)

What does that have to do with it? The facts still remain, the GTVA sorted its whole fleet at Capella to buy time for the evacuation and it got pulverized doing so.

 

Offline Mobius

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
I was refering to the first Sathanas and the fact that he decimates a consistent GTVA fleet if the player doesn't disarm its BFReds in Bearbaiting. Does that loss count in a post Capella GTVA? I guess so...

 

Offline TrashMan

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
Most of hte fleet lost...how much is that...60%...70%?

GTVA didn't lsoe all of it's fleet...otherwise the player, aquitaince and several other ship should also be very, very dead.
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Offline Mobius

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
We know that the Aquitaine and the Messana survived. :rolleyes:

 

Offline Bob-san

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
Collossus reconstruction could go either way. On the one hand, as has been pointed out, all the hard work (testing, designing etc. etc.) for collossus class ships had been done, they were exceptionally successful at what they were designed to do (eliminating destroyers)), plus all the yards and whatnot would have been in place, experienced personnel, etc. etc.

On the other hand, given the likely economic situation post capella, it might have been hard to get it budgetted for, especially with other major projects begging for funds (Sol knossos, Capellan refugee resettlement etc. etc.)

If I were in government, I think I'd raise taxes somewhat, and go for a second Collossus, while reactivating a few mothballed destroyers/cruisers etc. if they're available (I'm mostly thinking Typhons and atens here). I'd hold up the Collossus as a shining example of Terran Vasudan unity that was all that stood against the Shivan hordes, and a crew which bravely sacrificed their lives that others might be saved. In the event of the alliance fracturing (some of the old Terran Blocs breaking away, for example), a Collossus would be of great use in retaking them.

I definitely have to agree with you... the GTVA might not be the tactical genius they think they are, but they're certainly not stupid. The Colossus would likely be rebuilt in under half the time--remember that the Colossus was nothing but an **idea** until 20 years prior to first deployment. They designed the ship's hull from scratch. They designed every system, likely several times over. They designed every square inch of the Colossus during peace-time (less funds for design), tested it under high scrutiny and secrecy, and likely changed out many major components. The fact that it got done in 20 years is amazing--they had limited funding (compared to war periods) and only the high ranked of the GTVA knew about it. It takes years for companies like Boeing to design their aircraft--and the aircraft are a tiny fraction the size of even a Fenris or Levithan! Anyways--something the scale of a Colossus can be redone (with most of the blueprints) and tweaked for better effectiveness. I'd say the second Colossus would come out of drydock for shakedown within 10 years, then a new Colossus following every 5-8 years.
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Offline StarSlayer

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
From the cutscene it looks like they lost a Diemos  :ick:  *runs*
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Offline S-99

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
shivans can use unstable jump nodes, remember? the sathanas got through without a knossos, so why cant more shivans get through? you'd want many powerful ships that require minimal crew (and perhaps even automated ships, or atleast turrets). and they would probably replace blob turrets with something better (FL style ion cannons, fighter weapons, more beams). the fs2 fleet was, after all, the fs1 fleet with streamlining and beams.

Correction. Shivans can't get through collapsed nodes. Unstable nodes sure they can.
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
I doubt it, for the simple reason that the Colossus proved to be a logistical nightmare in practice, despite impressive combat performance. Then again, the 20-year development and construction cycle also likely played hell with systems integration. A newer design with a "frozen" hullform and gear would probably be a 5-8 year project.

But given the sheer expense of the Colossus and the resources it requires, and the need to rebuild the rest of the GTVA's military, it seems unlikely that another Colossus or similar ship would be in the works before the end of the decade immediately following Capella. Much of the ship's technology is likely to be reused however, possibly in a smaller, more manageable "hunter-killer" destroyer or superdestroyer. The concept proved sound but took too expensive a form; future designs would try and correct this.
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Offline TrashMan

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
logistical nightmare? No more than any other ship really. All point to the "supply to Colossus mission" as evidence of this logistical nightmare.

The Collie jsut arrived from the shipyard, so it wasn't fully stocked yet. I'm willing to bet that any ship leaving hte shipyards goes to a supply base first. But the Collie wen't straight in without taking supplies first, so htey had to bring em to him...WOW..what a logistical nightmare... :rolleyes:
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Offline Bob-san

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
Not to mention that, when fully stocked, the Colossus could likely go for several weeks without support. Think of a week-long rampage against a fleet...

Anyways--the Colossus was perfect at what it was designed to do... be a bloody nightmare to your fleet. Still, who thinks it's plausible to redesign and tweak the Colossus design in 2 years, followed by production in 5-8 years?
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Offline TrashMan

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
possible :nod:
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Offline Horus

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
Dosnt matter if the whole fleet was destroyed. As long as Alpha 1 survived then there is nothing to fear he can deal with any threat. You would think they would make the Collie V2. With the latest tech and new things they may have learned from fighting the saths

 

Offline Hades

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
Horus since your new I will tell you some rules, Please do not say stuff like "Alpha 1 can kill every thing" and such.

EDIT:I think i found karma's email address-      [email protected] For the HTL Colossus's ass.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2007, 06:28:27 pm by Hades »
[22:29] <sigtau> Hello, #hard-light?  I'm trying to tell a girl she looks really good for someone who doesn't exercise.  How do I word that non-offensively?
[22:29] <RangerKarl|AtWork> "you look like a big tasty muffin"
----
<batwota> wouldn’t that mean that it’s prepared to kiss your ass if you flank it :p
<batwota> wow
<batwota> KILL

 

Offline Horus

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
Ok seriously then, you would think there would be some kind of defensive line on the other side of the node in case any Shavian ships made it through. And to commit the entire GTVA fleet to evacuate one system when they control heaps of systems is a bad decision when ya never know whats out there. You would think they would have considered that if the shivans find another way through like a unknown jump node or somethink the GTVA may need some defence so would have keep some ships in reserve.

Horus since your new I will tell you some rules, Please do not say stuff like "Alpha 1 can kill every thing" and such.

Sorry if that pissed some people off wasnt ment too and wont happen again

 

Offline karajorma

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
It would be possible. We should take something in consideration: were the reinforcements sortied to face the first Sathanas or the Juggernaut fleet? In the second case, arriving in time would have been difficult.

Also, why would the GTVA send the whole fleet?

Now that is a more sensible objection. Remember I'm not saying that the GTVA did send the fleet, just that they could have if the fleet was ready to do it. People seem to make the assumption that it takes weeks to do fleet manoeuvres in FS2. It doesn't. The game directly contradicts that sort of thinking in several places.

You claimed that there wasn't time between the arrival of the first Sathanas and the second larger invasion of Capella to get the fleet there. Seeing as we're probably looking at a timescale of weeks rather than days I find that rather hard to believe.

Quote
Were the GTVA outposts in Vega, Epsilon Pegasi and Capella able to resupply a so big fleet? Epsilon Pegasi was still affected by what the NTF did a few weeks(days?)before.

I don't buy the resupply argument. Why would ships leave their home bases and need to resupply a day later? The NTF didn't seem to need to when they did a shorter run from their systems to GD.
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
logistical nightmare? No more than any other ship really. All point to the "supply to Colossus mission" as evidence of this logistical nightmare.

Happens to be the only time you're assigned to guard a supply convoy for a single warship, too. That convoy was as large or larger than the one in Battle of the Wilderness, and the Wilderness convoy was intended for the entirety of 3rd Fleet. (It also included no fueling ships!) Also there is commentary on the Colossus being a logistical strain in command briefings, including specific complaints about poor fuel efficeny.

Nowhere in the FS series do we see a supply convoy of similar size dedicated to a single ship, and most of the convoys for whole fleets are considerably smaller.

The Collie jsut arrived from the shipyard, so it wasn't fully stocked yet. I'm willing to bet that any ship leaving hte shipyards goes to a supply base first. But the Collie wen't straight in without taking supplies first, so htey had to bring em to him...WOW..what a logistical nightmare... :rolleyes:

Why the hell was it not fully stocked after construction? Hell, during construction? I refuse to believe it left the shipyard without a full load of fuel, that's just stupid. Granted both possiblities are conjecture, but yours makes a lot less sense than mine.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2007, 03:12:18 am by ngtm1r »
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Offline TrashMan

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
Why the hell was it not fully stocked after construction? Hell, during construction? I refuse to believe it left the shipyard without a full load of fuel, that's just stupid. Granted both possiblities are conjecture, but yours makes a lot less sense than mine.

AFAIK, that's how it's done... Ships get fully stocked after launch, not while they are still in the shipyard. Someone corrrect me if I'm wrong.
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Offline Hades

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
How do you know this?We don't know how long the Colossus was out of the ShipYards.If it was a week, that was probably why it needed fuel and such.
[22:29] <sigtau> Hello, #hard-light?  I'm trying to tell a girl she looks really good for someone who doesn't exercise.  How do I word that non-offensively?
[22:29] <RangerKarl|AtWork> "you look like a big tasty muffin"
----
<batwota> wouldn’t that mean that it’s prepared to kiss your ass if you flank it :p
<batwota> wow
<batwota> KILL

 

Offline TrashMan

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
Ya, Command just got a brand new uber-toy in the middle of a civil war they are loosing..Ya, they are gonna wait to deploy that toy. :rolleyes:

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Offline Hades

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Re: Post Capella, would another Colossus be built?
Ya, Command just got a brand new uber-toy in the middle of a civil war they are loosing..Ya, they are gonna wait to deploy that toy. :rolleyes:

Several test drives areound the block Jeeves!

They have to test it for one, and two They Were Not Loosing.
[22:29] <sigtau> Hello, #hard-light?  I'm trying to tell a girl she looks really good for someone who doesn't exercise.  How do I word that non-offensively?
[22:29] <RangerKarl|AtWork> "you look like a big tasty muffin"
----
<batwota> wouldn’t that mean that it’s prepared to kiss your ass if you flank it :p
<batwota> wow
<batwota> KILL