Author Topic: Capital ships - the use in FS1?  (Read 17533 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline nubbles526

  • 28
  • MODerate MODder
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
I remember command stating that inter-system subspace drives were very expensive. Outfitting thousands of fighters with them, as well as constructing more with each passing day as more fighters are coming out of mass production, the drain on money would be practically overwhelming. Stocking up a few squadrons of ships into a destroyer and sending that instead of individual fighters loaded with verry expensive drives would probably be more economical in the long run.

Really? Wow....I never knew there was such canon theory about refitting inter-system jumps on fighters.


THE APOCALYPSE PROJECT IS LOOKING FOR MEMBERS!!! SIGN UP AT:
The official forum | The official website

"Only a braindead idiot would take that post to mean that I'm planning on taking legal action on anyone and without cause or reason." -Derek Smart

Harsh words, Derek. Harsh words. And what do you get? No liscence, no FreeSpace, only some stfu from HLP. That is legal.

STEALTH AIN'T DEAD!!!!
A complete rewrite of the FS2 quotes!
HLP Cards! Click here to make one of yourself!

The original FreeSpace 3 wishlist!

Find the MOON challenge!

Your very fist dive....

 
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
Mod the weapons.tbl a bit and you'll have that effect. Also, add more damage to those weapons. Plus, in the ships.tbl trible the capital ship HP. Then have fun trying to survive the crossfire.

Where would I find weapons.tbl?  I downloaded all my stuff from Tureys installer (got tired of finding everything seperate with my install disks) and theres nothing in my data/tables folder.  I also did a search and it cant find the file anywhere  :confused:

 

Offline Droid803

  • Trusted poster of legit stuff
  • 213
  • /人 ◕ ‿‿ ◕ 人\ Do you want to be a Magical Girl?
    • Skype
    • Steam
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
its in root_fs2.vp
open it with a VP viewer.
(´・ω・`)
=============================================================

 

Offline jr2

  • The Mail Man
  • 212
  • It's prounounced jayartoo 0x6A7232
    • Steam
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
I remember command stating that inter-system subspace drives were very expensive. Outfitting thousands of fighters with them, as well as constructing more with each passing day as more fighters are coming out of mass production, the drain on money would be practically overwhelming. Stocking up a few squadrons of ships into a destroyer and sending that instead of individual fighters loaded with verry expensive drives would probably be more economical in the long run.

Really? Wow....I never knew there was such canon theory about refitting inter-system jumps on fighters.

Not theory CBAnim canon.  ;)  In FS1, not too aweful long after meeting the Shivans.

  

Offline Tantalus53

  • 29
  • That one guy with the thing
    • Steam
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
-allways knew that remembering the oddest bits-and-pieces of information would help me out one day-

Woo. Thanks Jr, i forgot where exactly i remembered it from...

 
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
its in root_fs2.vp
open it with a VP viewer.

Alright well, I can open and edit the .tbl files just fine, but I cant manage to be able to save any of my changes.  Im using vpview32_20 that comes with the FS2 download.  Is there some other tool out there that can manage to edit/save changes in VP files?  I tried a google search but all I managed to find was stuff relating to getting VP positions online  :lol:

 

Offline Droid803

  • Trusted poster of legit stuff
  • 213
  • /人 ◕ ‿‿ ◕ 人\ Do you want to be a Magical Girl?
    • Skype
    • Steam
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
(´・ω・`)
=============================================================

 
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
Thanks for the info.  I really encourage everyone to try out increased velocity for the terran huge/regular/weak turrets.  1500 for regular turrets and 1000 for huge turrets was really cool to watch as 2 Orions slugged it out with nothing but blobs.  Fire rate was also decreased to .5 seconds for reg turrets and 1 second for huge turrets, and just for looks, I increased the length of each laser by about 10x for each laser.  I also tried increasing the damage and just for fun put 4 bomber wings per side assigned to attack the enemy Orion.  I might have increased the damage a little too much though, as 2 hits from a huge turret destroyed an Ursa  :p  Really seemed like what capships should be able to do.  Though with the increased damage it wasnt long before everyone was dead, including me  :lol:  Ill for sure be using these edits to play the campaigns though, hopefully nothing game breaking comes up  :nervous:

 
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
In FS1, as has been said, capital ships probably played a large role during the 14-year war since attack craft were incapable of carrying weapons powerful enough to destroy large warships.

For FS2, I think you can actually put it in terms of modern naval warfare. Fighters are the kings (modern jet fighters). But you still have destroyers (Deimos corvettes), frigates (Aeolus cruisers), and carriers (Freespace Destroyers). Remember that mission in FS2 where you had to escort the Bastion to the jump gate while it was defended by 3 Aeolus cruisers? Seriously, heavy flak and AAAf beam concentration makes it very costly to attempt to attack a destroyer without other cap ship support.

Mod the weapons.tbl a bit and you'll have that effect. Also, add more damage to those weapons. Plus, in the ships.tbl trible the capital ship HP. Then have fun trying to survive the crossfire.
Heh, reminded me of X-Wing Alliance a bit. That is one game that pulls off the capship/fighter balance very well. Flying a fighter getting between an MC-80 and a Star Destroyer slugging it out was pretty suicidal. Chances of taking out anything heavier than a corvette in a fighter was very hard, save impossible if you were attacking an ISD. It would be interesting to re-balance FreeSpace to make the primary purpose of fighters to intercept small ships and bombers and all but impossible to destroy capital ships with fighter weaponry.

 

Offline brandx0

  • 210
  • The Angriest Angel.
    • Fate of the Galaxy: The Star Wars Conversion for Freespace
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
I dunno what version of X-Wing Alliance you were playing, but apparently it wasn't the same as me.  Damn Capships were pussies in that.  Not nearly as pussified as in FreeSpace, but still an X-Wing shouldn't be able to fly around into an ISD'd blindspot and fire at it until it slowly dies.
Former Senior Modeler, Texturer and Content Moderator (retired), Fate of the Galaxy
"I love your wrong proportions--too long, no, wait, too short
I love you with a highly symbolic torpedo up the exhaust port"
-swashmebuckle's ode to the transport

 

Offline WMCoolmon

  • Purveyor of space crack
  • 213
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
I think the biggest problem FS2 had for capship combat was beams. People have a hard time relating numbers to actual lives, even in the real world. 39,000 people were killed (initially) when the first nuclear bomb detonated, according to Wikipedia. Can you really conceive of that? I don't think I can. I don't think any human being can really, truly understand the loss of that many lives.

According to FW, a Hecate is 2174 m long and has a crew of 10,000. Following that, a Fenris at 253 m should have a crew of about 1,163 if the crew scales proportionally. An Aeolus at 272 m should have a little more than that. A Deimos at 717 m should have a crew of about 3,300.

For comparison, a Nimitz-class aircraft carrier (according to wikipedia) is the largest aircraft carrier in the world, has a crew of about 5,700, and is just 340 m long.

So destroying a Fenris is the equivalent to destroying a small town's worth of people. Destroying a Hecate is comparable to destroying two aircraft carriers. The destruction of the Colossus is roughly equivalent to the dropping of the first atomic bomb, and roughly 1/5 the death toll of the second. Yet we see all kinds of examples where an Aeolus is destroyed by a surprise beam salvo or a Fenris/Leviathan is destroyed by a runaway group of bombers. The destruction of the Lysander in the nebula occurs in a matter of seconds, yet represents about 3,300 people lost. Escape pods are never launched except as an afterthought when a Destroyer has nothing else to do.

And space is a lot more volatile medium for humans than water is. Not to mention that the explosion that takes out something that's 2km long has got one hell of a punch. Going back to the "Little Boy" example, the second atomic bomb, the force of the blast was 5psi at 1.6km away from the center of the blast. In Freespace 2, the hull of the ship is vaporized even 1km away from the blast. The only thing keeping anything within firing range alive would seem to be the lack of air around the exploding ship. Unfortunately for the crew in the tightly cramped passages of the ship, they have an abundance of air (for a short while anyway). It would be interesting to calculate if an Orion exploding in the atmosphere of a planet would represent an extinction-level event. Not to mention a Meson bomb...

Now you're trying to convey that scale of loss with an explosion sound and voice acting. The Lysander gets vaporized in ten seconds by a surprise shot from a Ravana's beam cannons. Everybody in the battlegroup has just lost dozens or hundreds of people they knew, just gone. It's really not something that you can really conceive of happening in ten seconds on the scale that it happens in Freespace. Without beams, you'd have several minutes of intense fighting, and then one of the ships would keel over and die. It might still lack any of the true impact it would have, but it would still seem more significant. With beams, a Fenris basically becomes a flying tin coffin for a thousand people.

Mackie makes a snide comment about life being cheap in earlier centuries in Derelict; Life actually seems like it's a whole lot cheaper in the Freespace universe.
-C

 

Offline ShadowGorrath

  • Not funny or clever
  • 211
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
It's war. You expect everyone to heroicaly survive there like in our action movies? And ships are hard to build... The GTVA was arrogant in FS2 and built bigger-and-stronger, instead of upgrading the older ships ( in armour terms I mean ).

 

Offline Snail

  • SC 5
  • 214
  • Posts: ☂
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
Obviously they were expecting a second Lucifer with assorted Cains and Liliths, in which case they certainly would have won.

 

Offline Fenrir

  • 28
  • ?
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
*Snip*

Yeah, I`ve thought of that every now and then. Like in the mission where the Repulse is destroyed, the Colossus says "You`re sacrificing tens of thousands of lives for nothing!" Last time I played that, I though "Wow, just think of all the Orions I`ve destroyed over the whole time I played FreeSpace. The deaths of millions are on my hands."

 

Offline Snail

  • SC 5
  • 214
  • Posts: ☂
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
FreeSpace messed up my conscience, but not as much as Halo...

Seriously, I think that the Vindicator and Uhuru were on a skeleton crew or something... :(

 

Offline SF-Junky

  • 29
  • Bread can mold, what can you do?
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
According to FW, a Hecate is 2174 m long and has a crew of 10,000. Following that, a Fenris at 253 m should have a crew of about 1,163 if the crew scales proportionally. An Aeolus at 272 m should have a little more than that. A Deimos at 717 m should have a crew of about 3,300.
According to the debriefing of "A Lion at the Door", the Dhashor has a crew of 6,000, so we can assume that the crew numbers of a Deimos ranks somewhere similar. But I for myself consider those numbers quite overdrawn. I mean, what does a corvette need a crew of 6,000 people for, when a destroyer with all its deck crews, field engineers and pilots needs "only" 10,000?

 

Offline Snail

  • SC 5
  • 214
  • Posts: ☂
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
Perhaps the Dashor had more refugees on it... Kind of stupid to do what it did in that case.

 

Offline SF-Junky

  • 29
  • Bread can mold, what can you do?
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
What refugees? From where should they have come?

 

Offline mr.WHO

  • 29
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
I also think that 6'000 is too much for such expendable ship.

About GTVA and Lucifer thread in FS2 there is a saying:
"When new war begin, all sides are perfectly prepared to wage the warfare of the previous war" - Sun Tzu or something like that ?

 

Offline Snail

  • SC 5
  • 214
  • Posts: ☂
Re: Capital ships - the use in FS1?
What refugees? From where should they have come?
Are you joking? Capella, where else!?! :wtf: