[Fineus]

Scotty was a stand-up comedian pretenting to be Scotty, Chekov was Chekov, Sulu was Sulu... ), the the effects cool ( although i couldn't see much of them because of the camera movements ).

In defense of Simons performance, I wonder if that was down to the writing of the film - not the actor?

The camera movement sucks ass...bigtime, a suggestion to the director of the next movie:
if you strap the camera on the back of a monkey that's suffering from a motorical disfunction, then for fraks sake, don't give the monkey speed or other stimulating dope.

I don't entirely disagree with you - but maybe I can at least give a reason for this, and it is having read a statement by the director that he wanted the film to be very - for lack of a better term - fast. Rather than slow paced smooth movements and visuals you can cope with, he went for ""oh-my-god-what's-going-on-I'm-really-here-oh-crap"... 'O Vision" which works to an extent as I certainly felt a few surges of adrenaline during the more action packed sections, but it can be a bit OTT sometimes.

That said, I'm being picky, I still loved the film.

[General Battuta]

The camera work would have been less irritating if it hadn't been paired with an incredibly bombastic and loud soundtrack.

Needed more BSG feel, not this...generic orchestral noise.

[Mobius]

"De Gustibus Non Disputandum Est"

[General Battuta]

No need to yell.

[Angelus]

Scotty was a stand-up comedian pretenting to be Scotty, Chekov was Chekov, Sulu was Sulu... ), the the effects cool ( although i couldn't see much of them because of the camera movements ).

In defense of Simons performance, I wonder if that was down to the writing of the film - not the actor?

probably, lets see how the writers/actors handle the next movie.

The camera movement sucks ass...bigtime, a suggestion to the director of the next movie:
if you strap the camera on the back of a monkey that's suffering from a motorical disfunction, then for fraks sake, don't give the monkey speed or other stimulating dope.

I don't entirely disagree with you - but maybe I can at least give a reason for this, and it is having read a statement by the director that he wanted the film to be very - for lack of a better term - fast. Rather than slow paced smooth movements and visuals you can cope with, he went for ""oh-my-god-what's-going-on-I'm-really-here-oh-crap"... 'O Vision" which works to an extent as I certainly felt a few surges of adrenaline during the more action packed sections, but it can be a bit OTT sometimes.

That said, I'm being picky, I still loved the film.

I had a good time during watching it ( except for the cam movement ), and as long i don't think about the plot it's ok.
The fast movement was, imo, a bit overexaggerated.

The camera work would have been less irritating if it hadn't been paired with an incredibly bombastic and loud soundtrack.

Needed more BSG feel, not this...generic orchestral noise.

I toned down the sound during watching so it didn't have that effect on me.
I like the BSG feel...in BSG.

In some scenes i had the feeling that all this BSG-fying was a bit to much.
The inside of the Kelvin, all scenes on Earth where the kadets get assigned to their ships a.s.o..
It looks like a refinery or some other industrial structure, it didn't has the typical Star Trek look i expected.

Oddly enough, if you think about it, it makes sense since it plays before the TOS series, so it's ok if it looks like they are still in a "build-up" phase.

[Mikes]

In some scenes i had the feeling that all this BSG-fying was a bit to much.
The inside of the Kelvin, all scenes on Earth where the kadets get assigned to their ships a.s.o..
It looks like a refinery or some other industrial structure, it didn't has the typical Star Trek look i expected.

Inside of a brewery, just goggle it.

All the "machine room scenes" and some others were filmed inside some brewery.

It's a bit too obvious in some scenes, but would have only been a minor issue for me if the plot would have been any good at all

[S-99]

The kelvin's auto pilot went out because it was powered by Vista. The autopilot software had consistent memory leaks and buffer overflows, which of course makes things crash in a time of dire need. GOOD JOB MICROTREK!!!!

Borgs are powered by Macos. You can tell because it makes the same noise as a mac starting up when a drone comes out of its regeneration alcove.

Young spock is powered by vegies, and the old spock is powered by prune juice.

Young kirk is powered by the fact that he didn't have much to do in the movie aside from getting a free ride on a pretty ship, and the old kirk is powered by the "Priceline Felatiator" promos.

And the enterprise escaping the black hole. Why not go faster than warp1, try going to warp2 or warp5. Something faster than the speed of light to escape a black hole should have done the job. But, simply learned, the improbability drive of the starship works similarly but through different ways in this movie compared to "Segway Masters Guide to the Galaxy".

[Flipside]

I suppose the only bit of non-canon that still kind of irks me is the fact that whilst the Federation knew who the Romulans were during the start of Kirks captaincy, they didn't know what the Romulans looked like, even the Vulcans didn't know they were an offshoot of their own race, that fact was revealed to Kirk and Spock during TOS, later in their careers, and yet, in the movie, this was a perfectly accepted fact.

Didn't ruin the movie in any way, was just something that occurred to me at the time.

[Mikes]

I suppose the only bit of non-canon that still kind of irks me is the fact that whilst the Federation knew who the Romulans were during the start of Kirks captaincy, they didn't know what the Romulans looked like, even the Vulcans didn't know they were an offshoot of their own race, that fact was revealed to Kirk and Spock during TOS, later in their careers, and yet, in the movie, this was a perfectly accepted fact.

Didn't ruin the movie in any way, was just something that occurred to me at the time.

Well, regarding the previously pointed out flaws of the movie, it's no wonder little details like these weren't even on their radar. But yeah, prolly only a few people will notice that one lol.

[Flipside]

Heh probably

I suppose the thing about that particular error is that many of the others were, at least, included as part of the plot such as:

Spoiler:

Spock revealing the formula for Transwarp (thus breaking the Prime Directive in the most absolute way possible, but almost understandable in the circumstances), Nero being the cause of Kirk's fathers' death etc, basically everything that had changed had been changed

Whilst others were simply misinterpretations, the Enterprise didn't originally have beam phasers, for example, in the first 2 series, it had little 'light ball' phasers that looked very similar to how photon torpedoes now look (though, in truth you rarely see the Enterprise fire because of SFX costs in the early series, the hand phasers were chosen as beams because you could just 'point and act' without little impact charges or anything), in that respect, Star Trek is more accurate than Enterprise.

This was an error about something that happened later in a different timeline, and is completely ignored, there's not even an unsatisfactory attempt to explain it, there's no attempt whatsoever, doesn't damage the movie at all, because everyone knows that Romulans and Vulcans are related, but just stood out for me.

[General Battuta]

Actually, it appears that 'they' - the writers - were aware of a lot of the little flaws like these. At least one of them was a huge Trek junky who'd read most of the novels. They made some sacrifices in the name of mainstream appeal.

[Flipside]

True, it would have been tricky to not only hit Spock with the loss of his planet, but, at the same time hit him with the fact that it was done by a planet of Vulcan exiles, it would probably have been a bit too much to deal with in one movie.

Many of the irregularities are at least techno-babbled away, which Star Trek is famous for anyway, though, in all fairness, the whole 'supernova' thing left me feeling a little disappointed, it would have taken a damn big star to 'threaten the entire galaxy' by going supernova, or a chain-event of some kind, that left me feeling a little let down, since it means in the last 3-4 Star Trek movies the score is:

Supernovas : 2 - Generations, Star Trek
Large Romulan Ships : 2 - Nemesis, Star Trek

In all fairness, however, Star Trek does it all a damn site better than Generations or especially Nemesis (More commonly known in these parts as 'The Revenge of Right-Said Fred').

[Roanoke]

Strange, I'm only a casual Trek watcher so I probably enjoy the films more than a "true" fan. Especially the more irksome films like Search for Spock. I didn't mind that one atall, though that's prtobably more because of nostalgia etc.

[TrashMan]

I just re-read the 4 comics just to make sure.

My conclusion stands - utter plot garbage.

Heck, even the movie is better plot-wise than the prequel comics.....

[butter_pat_head]

Heh probably
 the Enterprise didn't originally have beam phasers, for example, in the first 2 series, it had little 'light ball' phasers that looked very similar to how photon torpedoes now look (though, in truth you rarely see the Enterprise fire because of SFX costs in the early series, the hand phasers were chosen as beams because you could just 'point and act' without little impact charges or anything), in that respect, Star Trek is more accurate than Enterprise.

The Phasers in TOS were beams.  The episodes "The Doomsday Machine" and "Obsession".  AFAIK, the only Star Trek show to deviate from this was Wrath of Khan.  All other instances of phaser fire in pre Trek'09 have been beams unless they have been specifically stated otherwise, and that has only happened twice.  The first time was in DS9 where some Marquis raiders were mentioned to have a different type (Mk9s I think, can't remember) and of course the Defiant class of ships.

Anyway, stuff like this make hardly any differences to the file compared to the other larger flaws mentioned earlier in the tread.

BTW, I haven't read the comic.  I went into the theatre blissfully unaware that there was one and to be honest one shouldn't be needed at all.  Trek has always been a onscreen experience and never once at the end of an episode of movie did they say "to answer all you questions and fill in any holes in this episode go and buy XXX and read it...".

But then again, I didn't stay and watch the credits all the way through but the way some people in this thread are saying to the effect of "But in the comic blah blah blah..." they probably did put such a adver hint at the end of the film.

[karajorma]

The point of mentioning the comic is to distinguish between two major arguments against the movie.

1) x is a plot hole. It is a major failing of the movie to have this happen. Movies shouldn't have gigantic holes in them. You shouldn't need to read anything in order to understand the movie. The writers did a bad job on the script.
2) x is a plot hole. It is a major failing of the writers not to have considered this fact as an important and obvious part of Trek. The writers obviously don't know Trek very well at all.

The latter argument has been made in several places where the existence of the comic proves it is flawed argument. It proves that the writers may have considered that plot issue and may have had a backstory that answered it.

If they ****ed up explaining that to the audience then go with argument 1) but arguing 2), quite correctly, opens you up to people pointing at the comic and saying "No, they did consider it."

There's been far too many people arguing 2) when they should have been arguing 1).

[TrashMan]

But it's BOTH 1 and 2.

[General Battuta]

2 is demonstrably false, though. At least one of the writers is a huge Trek continuity junkie who read all the novels in addition to watching the various series.

[TrashMan]

2 is demonstrably false, though. At least one of the writers is a huge Trek continuity junkie who read all the novels in addition to watching the various series.

I'd also say that having people/races/factions behaving as morons is doing the franchise a disservice.

[General Battuta]

Now you're making argument #1 from Kara's post, which is one I happen to agree with.