You simply have to agree that Brain B is just as valid a home to the Magical Fluid.
No, I don't haev to agree with anything.
You are simply, completely, utterly, totally 1 billion percent wrong....and apparently you don't read anything I post. You yell apples, I say oranges.
The perfection or validity of the copies is irrelevant. The exprience and POV is relevant. Bob1, Bob2, Bob3, Bob4 all have different points of view and are all separate entities - they all feel for themselves, see for themselves, experience only themselves and have their own sense of self.
It doesn't really matter which Bob you are - if you die, you don't continue to live trough another Bob. Period.
No, look, I see where you're missing it. It is a very simple, very seductive, and very understandable error. I am reading and understanding everything you said, because really, this is the objection everybody has.
Everything you said there is correct. If you go and get your brain scanned, you will sit down, get scanned, walk out, and not feel any different. If you're hit by a car, you're dead. Gone. You're utterly correct about that. You will not somehow wake up as your copy.
But that's assuming you stuck with Original-You POV.
Because it's just as valid
to say that you sit down in that chair, get scanned, and wake up in a new body with the tragic news that Original You is dead.
"Wait!" you're saying. "That's not me
. It's just, like, my twin. I am dead.
And you're right. The you that walked out the door is dead. But the you that was you up until the moment of the scan
is still alive, completely continuous, in a new body.
At the moment of the scan, you forked
. And one You is still alive. You're toitally right, the other one is dead and gone forever
. But it wasn't the repository of some Special You Fluid that is now lost.
The mistake you're making is always taking the pessimistic fork. To work yourself out of it, try to think about it this way:
You are a brain. You are put in the Claw Machine. It does something very simple. It picks you up and moves you a few meters to the left. You're still the same person, right? TrashBrain? Good good. All you've done is moved, after all.
Now, you are put in the Blink Machine. It does the same thing, but way more high-tech. It scans you, dematerializes you, moves you a few meters to the left, and reconstructs you. But you're still the same person, right? You felt a weird blink, and technically you were dead for a few seconds, but all you've done is moved. Same as the Claw Machine.
Now, you are put in a faulty Blink Machine, Blink 2. It moves you via teleportation, just like the Blink Machine. But it leaves a copy of you back behind at the origin. "Whoa," you say, looking back with your brain eyes. "I've now got a twin. That's ****ing weird."
But you're still you, right? You've been moved. It's not your fault a copy got left behind at the origin.
That all makes sense, right? No problems there?
When I know you're with me I'll wrap it up.
As a metacommentary, I think part of the very reasonable trouble that TrashMan has with this is because people have this idea that there is a little them
inside their brains which kind of sits back and watches. And if the brain was rebuilt as a perfect model right next to them, that couldn't be them
, because the Little Man Inside My Head Who Is Me is still in their
head, right? Not in this new model. But people need to remember that the Little Man is being transferred too.
It's really weird to think about. Clearly, if you get a copy made, and then you die in a fire, you're not waking up as the copy.
You're just as dead as if you hadn't made the copy. But that's because you're past the fork
. After you make that copy, you're on your own: you're a regular mortal. But all of you that was in existence up until the copy
is going to be preserved and past on.
A HA PROFOUND MOMENT OF REALIZATION.
What TrashMan doesn't get, and what I think intrinsically terrifies all of us, is that we die every single moment of every single day. The person we were just a moment ago is irretrievably, intrinsically lost...unless, of course, he was backed up.
As soon as the scan finishes, as soon as you walk out of the room, you start dying again. And whatever comes back to life is going to be you from the moment of the scan. And that resurrected clone won't be you, you're sure, because you aren't just blinking at the moment the car hits and waking up in a new body, like the Cylons would.
We're not afraid of dying. We're afraid of discontinuity. And even though we die every moment of every die, we don't think we're dying, because we have continuity.
That's why we're okay with having our brain pulled out and transferred into a new body. That's why we're okay with our brain being scanned and rematerialized in a new body, even though the original brain is being disintegrated.
And that's why we're not okay
with our brain being scanned and remateralized in a new body if the original isn't destroyed.
We believe there has to be one single cord of 'us' that flows continuously without branching...because if we believe that, then we don't have to face our continual, moment-to-moment extinction.
That's really rather profound. And beautiful. *sniff*
Of course, there's an easy way around this phobia, which I think most people (like Kosh) find totally acceptable. Even TrashMan probably wouldn't mind it. If you have awesome neural implants, and an awesome connection, just have yourself be scanned constantly.
Maintain a real-time replica of your brain at an outboard location. If you die in your real body, you instantly 'snap over' to your backup, just as you were.
It preserves the illusion of continuity. It appeals to our own illusion that we haven't died a thousand times already.
To appeal to the nerd in you: we are fine with the Cylons dying and resurrecting in a new body. We believe it's the same person. But if that Cylon just downloaded without dying
, and then there were two Caprica-Sixes, we would see them as two different people.
And yet the only difference between the two scenarios is that, in one, the original is destroyed.
Man, sometimes I ****ing impress myself.