Author Topic: Question about jump nodes  (Read 7100 times)

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Offline Snail

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Re: Question about jump nodes
It's easy to commit genocide by bombarding Earth from orbit, but you really don't want to.

1) Once you've finished destroying the birthplace of humanity, all of your shiny destroyers will be gone (destroyed by Durgas). Remember the UEF can shove Durgas down your destroyers' throats before they can jump out. Even if you somehow manage to save your destroyers, your support craft and fighter squadrons will be in tatters.

2) GTVA populace probably wouldn't take too kindly to their government committing mass genocide (probably leading to huge civil unrest and rebellion - You could always crush this with more orbital bombardment, but really now?).

3) You have achieved nothing militarily. All the infrastructure we wanted to capture intact is gone, and at the cost of a lot of our capital ships and crewmen. Steele's Blitz on Earth was pragmatic evil, destroying everything is just stupid cartoon villain evil.

4) You've achieved nothing politically. You've now shown everyone involved without a doubt that the Tevs are officially the bad guys. Remember that the whole damn point of the war was to make sure we were able to fight the Shivans by getting rid of Ubuntu pacifism. Not only have you needlessly wasted a lot of our capital ship deterrant, but also probably galvanized Ubuntu beliefs and splintered Terran population (see point 2). The Zods probably wouldn't take to kindly to genocide either.



Sure the UEF would be wiped clean from history but realistically so would the GTVA by the time you're finished.

 

Offline mjn.mixael

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Re: Question about jump nodes
So... what does all this have to do with....

In FS canon, do jump nodes revolve around their system's star(s) like planets?  Or do they remain static relative to other bodies and stellar phenomena in system?

?

(Just curious)
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Offline MatthTheGeek

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Re: Question about jump nodes
"No canon info" is probably the only answer you'll get.
People are stupid, therefore anything popular is at best suspicious.

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Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Question about jump nodes
I'd propose that they are influenced by gravity and revolve around the stars. Otherwise it makes no sense for the nodes to keep up with the star's path through the galaxy.

 

Offline Snail

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Re: Question about jump nodes
So... what does all this have to do with....

In FS canon, do jump nodes revolve around their system's star(s) like planets?  Or do they remain static relative to other bodies and stellar phenomena in system?

?

(Just curious)
Oh wait, this is that thread?

I thought this was another thread entirely. :blah:

 
Re: Question about jump nodes
In High Noon, the Gamma Draconis and Vega jump nodes are just under 34 kilometers away from one another. Sun scale is 2.

In Their Finest Hour, we're at the Gamma Draconis node. The Vega node is nowhere in sight. Sun scale is 2.25.

In Apocalypse, we're at the Vega node. The Gamma Draconis node is nowhere in sight. Sun scale is 2.

In Exodus, we're at the Epsilon Pegasi node. No other nodes are present. Sun scale is 1.

In Clash of the Titans II, we're told in the briefing that we're going to the Epsilon Pegasi  node (it's "Jump Node 0" in the mission, but whatever). "Jump Node 1," which could be either Vega or Gamma Draconis, is just over 29.5 kilometers away. Sun scale is 2.

Canon is pretty clear that jump nodes move relative to their primaries and to one another.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2011, 02:29:12 pm by LordPomposity »

 

Offline mjn.mixael

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Re: Question about jump nodes
Good research! IMO, that's pretty conclusive, even if it's the result of :v: not thinking it through...
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Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Question about jump nodes
No, what the canon is clear about is they didn't give a damn about it at all... oh well I rather preferred the influenced by gravity version.

I'll stick to it myself then.

 
Re: Question about jump nodes
No, what the canon is clear about is they didn't give a damn about it at all...

That too. :D

 

Offline mjn.mixael

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Re: Question about jump nodes
No, what the canon is clear about is they didn't give a damn about it at all... oh well I rather preferred the influenced by gravity version.

I'll stick to it myself then.

I believe I even said that in my post.... (That they didn't care/think it through.)

However, the fact remains that in canon missions, the nodes are all over the place.. and given that the original question was whether or not nodes could move within systems... that is pretty conclusive evidence that they do. Whatever the "Scientific" reason is, doesn't really matter.
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Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Question about jump nodes
^ Yeah I was replying to Lord's comment, not yours.

 

Offline TrashMan

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Re: Question about jump nodes
It's easy to commit genocide by bombarding Earth from orbit, but you really don't want to.

1) Once you've finished destroying the birthplace of humanity, all of your shiny destroyers will be gone (destroyed by Durgas). Remember the UEF can shove Durgas down your destroyers' throats before they can jump out. Even if you somehow manage to save your destroyers, your support craft and fighter squadrons will be in tatters.

BS.
Bombers are slow and ponderous. It takes just a minute or two for a destroyers jump drive to re-charge.
That, plus it's escorting fighter complement = bye, bye Durgas.

Go ahead...do a little sim and you'll see what I mean. By the time bombers launch, evade the interceptors, get a lock, fire, and the SLOW bombs traverse the distance or hit (assuming they're not shot down) - FAR more than a minute.
But time enough for a few beam salvos.


Quote
2) GTVA populace probably wouldn't take too kindly to their government committing mass genocide (probably leading to huge civil unrest and rebellion - You could always crush this with more orbital bombardment, but really now?).

You dont have to. With Earth as your mean shield, the UEF will be responsible for any damage.
And the threat of destruiction might be enough.

Note that it's not even necessary to do even that. A massed attacked on the UEF fleet is all that's necessary. Without jump limitations, logistics problems from bringing in an entire fleet are non-existent.


Quote
4) You've achieved nothing politically. You've now shown everyone involved without a doubt that the Tevs are officially the bad guys. Remember that the whole damn point of the war was to make sure we were able to fight the Shivans by getting rid of Ubuntu pacifism. Not only have you needlessly wasted a lot of our capital ship deterrant, but also probably galvanized Ubuntu beliefs and splintered Terran population (see point 2). The Zods probably wouldn't take to kindly to genocide either.

Given how tight the media control by hte GTVA is...who would know? And who would be blamed? Heck, with carefull media manipulation, yo ucould even blame the UEF for any damage caused during hte battle.
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Offline Scotty

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Re: Question about jump nodes
tl;dr TrashMan doesn't understand BP canon.

 

Offline MatthTheGeek

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Re: Question about jump nodes
tl;dr TrashMan doesn't understand BP canon.
Old news are old.
People are stupid, therefore anything popular is at best suspicious.

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666maslo666: Releasing a finished product is not a good thing! It is a modern fad.

SpardaSon21: it seems like you exist in a permanent state of half-joking misanthropy

Axem: when you put it like that, i sound like an insane person

bigchunk1: it's not retarded it's american!
bigchunk1: ...

batwota: steele's maneuvering for the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: you mispelled grâce
Awaesaar: grace
batwota: oh right :P
Darius: ah!
Darius: yes, i like that
MatthTheGeek: the way you just spelled it it means fat
Awaesaar: +accent I forgot how to keyboard
MatthTheGeek: or grease
Darius: the killing fat!
Axem: jabba does the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: XD
Axem: bring me solo and a cookie

 

Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Question about jump nodes
Biggest problem with Trash's theory, considering it is possible inside BP's canon, is the notion that the GTVA fleet can operate between UEF and earth, using the latter as a shield. Not if you jump into the battlefield sideways, my bro ;).

 

Offline Snail

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Re: Question about jump nodes
Everyone vote TrashMan for Secretary-General of the General Assembly!


 

Offline TrashMan

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Re: Question about jump nodes
Ultimatively Earth is irrelevant.

Without range and logistics being a issue (and unlimited jump drive do just that), the UEF stands NO chance whatsoever. Teh bbigger fish wins. And GTVA is the bigger fish.

Tell me, what is stopping the GTVA from using it's superior numbers and close-range firepower?
What is stoping them from ammasing a large fleet and jumping  right next to most important UEF military assests and vaporizing them?
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Offline MatthTheGeek

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Re: Question about jump nodes
Of course. Problem is, logistics ARE an issue. It's made very, very clear in WiH.

Have you even played it ?
People are stupid, therefore anything popular is at best suspicious.

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666maslo666: Releasing a finished product is not a good thing! It is a modern fad.

SpardaSon21: it seems like you exist in a permanent state of half-joking misanthropy

Axem: when you put it like that, i sound like an insane person

bigchunk1: it's not retarded it's american!
bigchunk1: ...

batwota: steele's maneuvering for the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: you mispelled grâce
Awaesaar: grace
batwota: oh right :P
Darius: ah!
Darius: yes, i like that
MatthTheGeek: the way you just spelled it it means fat
Awaesaar: +accent I forgot how to keyboard
MatthTheGeek: or grease
Darius: the killing fat!
Axem: jabba does the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: XD
Axem: bring me solo and a cookie

 

Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Question about jump nodes
'Coz it's precisely a game of cat n' mouse? Where you have to figure out where the ships are effectively hiding? And dunno if you noticed, but BP WiH p1 did show a bunch of moments just like the ones you are describing. For instance, when two lone frigates made a SOS through space, the serk team found them out and beamraped them. But what do I know right?

 

Offline TrashMan

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Re: Question about jump nodes
Of course. Problem is, logistics ARE an issue. It's made very, very clear in WiH.

Have you even played it ?

I have.
But what teh game sez and what the tech room sez and what the fluff sez and what the common sense sez...can be different things.

I couldn't care less how strongly the briefing sez logistic are an issue, if the very bacground fluff contradicts it.
Jump drives wihout limits = trivial logistics. This is not even debatable.
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