Author Topic: On Religious Discussion in HLP  (Read 20065 times)

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Offline deathfun

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
Guys you are missing something important here.

Homogenous force fields can't be used to generate energy, only to store it (and get it back when convenient).

In other words even if you can make the cat/bread combination float (or just the bread although I would like to point out obvious handling and maintenance difficulties with entirely buttered bread - it would require magnetic confinement so as to not disturb the butter coating), this would not be sufficient to generate kinetic energy.

There are other examples where the same thing happens, namely superconducting levitation, vacuum-generated attracting force on plates at close proximity due to Casimir effect, gravitational potential energy, springs, and rubber bands.

In all these cases, a force is present, but does not do work. To make the force do work, a deflection from balance state is required - which means you're putting energy into the system.


In other words, no free energy from cats and buttered bread. Both examples would, when dropped, fall to close proximity with the nearest surface in the direction of positive gravitational gradient, at which point the effects of buttered bread and cat would kick in and result in stabilized levitation, at which point it would be of no use to anyone but science fair organizers and the Nobel committee.



There is also a competing hypothesis that the cat would simply ignore the bread and butter, and an entirely buttered bread would simply fall any side down. Also if bread is really light and there's a thick coating of butter, that makes butter side heavier but doesn't significantly move the centre of aerodynamic pressure, and when centre of gravity and centre of pressure are misaligned you end up with a stable projectile that tends to align itself so that centre of pressure is behind the centre of gravity.

Ie. a buttered bread, falling a great distance, would tend to stabilize itself to fall butter-side first.

This view has never gained much foothold, though, and should be considered a marginal possibility only until it has been experimentally confirmed.



By the way, the clever ideas playing around with bread-butter topology are NOT A GOOD IDEA. At best, you'll rip a hole in the bread-butter continuum. At worst, butter and bread crumbs will be everywhere like an Eldritch Abomination.


Also, I have always wondered how buttered breads behave in microgravity, such as onboard a space station. Is the tendency to "fall" butter side down related to gravity, or more of an attractive force between the butter and nearby surfaces, and gravity gradient direction only explains why the bread most often contacts the floor as opposed to walls or the ceiling?

It could be some sort of timeline effect where the adhesive effect of butter acting between surface and bread, from the future, affect the present!


This warrants experimentation.

You are indeed correct that it simply floating would do nothing. However, if you spin it, it will act as though it was in a vacuum causing it to spin indefinitely as it acts differently to a floating plate. The field generated by the cat-butter is based off of two different laws trying to achieve the same true value. If it were to obtain equilibrium, that would mean a bias towards one of the particular laws either the bread, or the cat.
"No"

 

Offline Herra Tohtori

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
You are indeed correct that it simply floating would do nothing. However, if you spin it, it will act as though it was in a vacuum causing it to spin indefinitely as it acts differently to a floating plate. The field generated by the cat-butter is based off of two different laws trying to achieve the same true value. If it were to obtain equilibrium, that would mean a bias towards one of the particular laws either the bread, or the cat.


Ah, but are the cat-force and butter-force separate forces, or manifestations of the same natural phenomenon?*

You would be well advised to not think of "laws" of physics as synonymous to forces of nature. They are merely our descriptions of the nature.

Also, multiple forces can reach an equilibrium quite fine, otherwise matter would not exist in stable configuration. Repulsing and attracting Coulomb forces, strong nuclear force, gravity, inertia... equilibriums exist everywhere in the nature, and just as abundantly there is a presence of naturally oscillating systems that demonstrate a fine byplay of energy exchanges through the forces of nature.



*Superficially both would seem to be related to gravity, but in deeper inspection gravity proves to only be the defining force for direction of general movement (gravitational acceleration). In case of bread-butter force, the main phenomenon would be possibly air resistance providing stabilizing tendency to settle on a butter-first flight state, and the tendency of human mind to statistically favour negative events in perceptive memorization. Cat-force is mainly just cat's remarkable skill in controlling its position while falling, utilizing its limbs, tail, and body to flail around to achieve desired attitude before impact.



Yes. I just suggested that both cat-force and bread-butter-force are apparent forces rather than real forces.

Just like gravity, coriolis-force, and centrifugal force... their existence depends on choice of some very specific reference frame (of mind). If we exit such reference frame, said forces disappear...
There are three things that last forever: Abort, Retry, Fail - and the greatest of these is Fail.

 

Offline Nuke

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
I have a question. Will the toast cat generator still float if you do not feed it?

no, while a live cat lands on its feet, a dead cat will land in any orientation. so you must constantly feed energy (in the form of cat food) into the system to sustain power generation.
I can no longer sit back and allow communist infiltration, communist indoctrination, communist subversion, and the international communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids.

Nuke's Scripting SVN

  

Offline Herra Tohtori

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
I have a question. Will the toast cat generator still float if you do not feed it?

no, while a live cat lands on its feet, a dead cat will land in any orientation. so you must constantly feed energy (in the form of cat food) into the system to sustain power generation.


But what if cat is in a sealed box with a clever setup involving neurotoxin released by possible decay of a radioactive particle?

Without opening the box and finding out, the cat could be either dead, or alive... would this affect the bread-butter-cat-surface interaction (or simulation of) in any meaningful manner?
There are three things that last forever: Abort, Retry, Fail - and the greatest of these is Fail.

 

Offline deathfun

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
The universal laws of the cat-feet and bread-butter phenomenon are simple unfathomable

Also, love the Schrodinger reference
"No"

 

Offline Ghostavo

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
I have a question. Will the toast cat generator still float if you do not feed it?

no, while a live cat lands on its feet, a dead cat will land in any orientation. so you must constantly feed energy (in the form of cat food) into the system to sustain power generation.


But what if cat is in a sealed box with a clever setup involving neurotoxin released by possible decay of a radioactive particle?

Without opening the box and finding out, the cat could be either dead, or alive... would this affect the bread-butter-cat-surface interaction (or simulation of) in any meaningful manner?

You'd need to put whatever device you want to power into other sealed boxes so as not to indirectly observe the state of the cat.
"Closing the Box" - a campaign in the making :nervous:

Shrike is a dirty dirty admin, he's the destroyer of souls... oh god, let it be glue...

 

Offline Scotty

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
The cat will also still die if not fed regardless of the possible decay of the particle. :P

 

Offline deathfun

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
The cat will also still die if not fed regardless of the possible decay of the particle. :P

All this dead cat talk has got me hungry
What the hell is wrong with me
"No"

 

Offline LordMelvin

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
The cat will also still die if not fed regardless of the possible decay of the particle. :P

All this dead cat talk has got me hungry
What the hell is wrong with me

For starters, you're in this thread. Beyond that... well, really what else would it take?
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Offline deathfun

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  • Hey man. Peace. *Car hits them* Frakking hippies
Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
The cat will also still die if not fed regardless of the possible decay of the particle. :P

All this dead cat talk has got me hungry
What the hell is wrong with me

For starters, you're in this thread. Beyond that... well, really what else would it take?

Are you trying to get into my pants? D:
As for being in this thread... well I just couldn't let the toaster thing slide. Just couldn't...
"No"

 

Offline LordMelvin

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
The cat will also still die if not fed regardless of the possible decay of the particle. :P

All this dead cat talk has got me hungry
What the hell is wrong with me

For starters, you're in this thread. Beyond that... well, really what else would it take?

Are you trying to get into my pants? D:
As for being in this thread... well I just couldn't let the toaster thing slide. Just couldn't...
No thanks, I've got my own pants. They're corduroy!
Error: ls.rnd.sig.txt not found

 

Offline S-99

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
The cat will also still die if not fed regardless of the possible decay of the particle. :P
Use a zombie cat.
Every pilot's goal is to rise up in the ranks and go beyond their purpose to a place of command on a very big ship. Like the colossus; to baseball bat everyone.

SMBFD

I won't use google for you.

An0n sucks my Jesus ring.

 

Offline deathfun

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  • Hey man. Peace. *Car hits them* Frakking hippies
Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
The cat will also still die if not fed regardless of the possible decay of the particle. :P

All this dead cat talk has got me hungry
What the hell is wrong with me

For starters, you're in this thread. Beyond that... well, really what else would it take?

Are you trying to get into my pants? D:
As for being in this thread... well I just couldn't let the toaster thing slide. Just couldn't...
No thanks, I've got my own pants. They're corduroy!

YOU GOT SOMETHING AGAINST KHAKIS? WHORE!
"No"

 

Offline jdjtcagle

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  • Already told you people too much!
Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
I can always count on coming back here every 8 months and see a religion thread on the front page of here. Maybe I have good timing or maybe we take the whole thing way too serious. Can't we all just get along. :p

-1 for not adding to the topic. :nervous:


Anyway, just popping in and saying hey.
"Brings a tear of nostalgia to my eye" -Flipside
------------------------------------------
I'm an Apostolic Christian (Acts: 2:38)
------------------------------------------
Official Interplay Freespace Stories
Predator
Hammer Of Light - Omen of Darkness
Freefall in Darkness
A Thousand Years

 

Offline deathfun

  • 210
  • Hey man. Peace. *Car hits them* Frakking hippies
Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
I can always count on coming back here every 8 months and see a religion thread on the front page of here. Maybe I have good timing or maybe we take the whole thing way too serious. Can't we all just get along. :p

-1 for not adding to the topic. :nervous:


Anyway, just popping in and saying hey.

+1 to counter the fact you haven't noticed that well...
These past couple pages have had nothing to do with religion
"No"

 

Offline jdjtcagle

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  • Already told you people too much!
Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
I can always count on coming back here every 8 months and see a religion thread on the front page of here. Maybe I have good timing or maybe we take the whole thing way too serious. Can't we all just get along. :p

-1 for not adding to the topic. :nervous:


Anyway, just popping in and saying hey.

+1 to counter the fact you haven't noticed that well...
These past couple pages have had nothing to do with religion

To be honest didn't read past the first page, just enjoyed the original post. Brings me back. lol

Man, it's hard to think I was just a kid when I started going here, I've done a lot of growing up since then.
"Brings a tear of nostalgia to my eye" -Flipside
------------------------------------------
I'm an Apostolic Christian (Acts: 2:38)
------------------------------------------
Official Interplay Freespace Stories
Predator
Hammer Of Light - Omen of Darkness
Freefall in Darkness
A Thousand Years

 

Offline deathfun

  • 210
  • Hey man. Peace. *Car hits them* Frakking hippies
Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
I can always count on coming back here every 8 months and see a religion thread on the front page of here. Maybe I have good timing or maybe we take the whole thing way too serious. Can't we all just get along. :p

-1 for not adding to the topic. :nervous:


Anyway, just popping in and saying hey.

+1 to counter the fact you haven't noticed that well...
These past couple pages have had nothing to do with religion

To be honest didn't read past the first page, just enjoyed the original post. Brings me back. lol

Man, it's hard to think I was just a kid when I started going here, I've done a lot of growing up since then.

Haha, I know the feeling, albeit different forum. As for reading, read this page, page six, and page five
"No"

 

Offline LordMelvin

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
I can always count on coming back here every 8 months and see a religion thread on the front page of here. Maybe I have good timing or maybe we take the whole thing way too serious. Can't we all just get along. :p

-1 for not adding to the topic. :nervous:


Anyway, just popping in and saying hey.

+1 to counter the fact you haven't noticed that well...
These past couple pages have had nothing to do with religion

To be honest didn't read past the first page, just enjoyed the original post. Brings me back. lol

Man, it's hard to think I was just a kid when I started going here, I've done a lot of growing up since then.

Haha, I know the feeling, albeit different forum. As for reading, read this page, page six, and page five
Is this turning into one of those long quote trees? I know some people really don't like them.
Error: ls.rnd.sig.txt not found

 
Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
I can always count on coming back here every 8 months and see a religion thread on the front page of here. Maybe I have good timing or maybe we take the whole thing way too serious. Can't we all just get along. :p

-1 for not adding to the topic. :nervous:


Anyway, just popping in and saying hey.

+1 to counter the fact you haven't noticed that well...
These past couple pages have had nothing to do with religion

To be honest didn't read past the first page, just enjoyed the original post. Brings me back. lol

Man, it's hard to think I was just a kid when I started going here, I've done a lot of growing up since then.

Haha, I know the feeling, albeit different forum. As for reading, read this page, page six, and page five
Is this turning into one of those long quote trees? I know some people really don't like them.
I don't know.  How about I quote you and maybe we can find out? :P
17:37:02   Quanto: I want to have sexual intercourse with every space elf in existence
17:37:11   SpardaSon21: even the males?
17:37:22   Quanto: its not gay if its an elf

[21:51] <@Droid803> I now realize
[21:51] <@Droid803> this will be SLIIIIIGHTLY awkward
[21:51] <@Droid803> as this rich psychic girl will now be tsundere for a loli.
[21:51] <@Droid803> OH WELLL.

See what you're missing in #WoD and #Fsquest?

[07:57:32] <Caiaphas> inspired by HerraTohtori i built a supermaneuverable plane in ksp
[07:57:43] <Caiaphas> i just killed my pilots with a high-g maneuver
[07:58:19] <Caiaphas> apparently people can't take 20 gees for 5 continuous seconds
[08:00:11] <Caiaphas> the plane however performed admirably, and only crashed because it no longer had any guidance systems

 

Offline Mars

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Re: On Religious Discussion in HLP
It kind of pisses me off that a thread about cessation of trolling has become one of the longest running troll threads.