Author Topic: Coronavirus Outbreak  (Read 28747 times)

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Offline Mongoose

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Still attempting to teach from home, whatever "teaching" even means at this point.  At least there are just a few weeks left.  Going out to the supermarket remains an absolute ****-show.  I feel like the world's worst cowboy every time I step out in public with a bandana tied around my face.

 

Online Su-tehp

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Still attempting to teach from home, whatever "teaching" even means at this point.  At least there are just a few weeks left.  Going out to the supermarket remains an absolute ****-show.  I feel like the world's worst cowboy every time I step out in public with a bandana tied around my face.

Don't worry, you'll get used to it. If the managers at your supermarket have any brains, they're requiring all customers (and employees) to be wearing masks before they're allowed in the store. That's the policy at my local Giant supermarket where I work, anyway. If everyone is wearing a mask alongside you, you'll feel a lot less stupid. And if you're the only one wearing a mask? Then you'll feel a lot less stupid when they're drowning in their own blood and you're not. It balances out in the end.
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Offline starlord

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Sadly, unless you have active masks like n95s, it doesn’t.

Passive masks such as surgical grade masks are only effective in preventing your spittle from infecting others, but sadly will be inadequate at filtering outside contaminants. So, if the fact of wearing a mask isn’t followed unanimously, then it’s pretty much useless, which is one of the reasons why there was so much talk about rerouting masks to health authorities in France, despite public uproar.

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Any mask which doesn't cover all the soft tissue membranes is ineffective.   So full face respirators or filtered respirator and swimming goggles is the only way you'll keep it out of a head based entry as everyone seems to forget the eyes.. . 😂

Romeo state CBRN training is mandatory in the British army and we were required to complete regular (at least annual) qualification to prove effectiveness in those scenarios.

All an unfiltered cloth mask (like all these homemade ones with lovely patterns I'm seeing flood social media) does, is after a few minutes of normal breathing, it creates a humid panel in front of your mouth and nose which makes an excellent dragnet for everything to adhere to.   

 

Offline starlord

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Very true.

Also, excellent point about the eyes by the way, which somehow never seems to get across.

 
Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
It still reduces the range at which particles are transmitted. No one is saying it's an impenetrable aegis, but it's better than just giving up. Some of the general public is already against taking the most basic precautionary steps, they need to be prodded to do the bare minimum for public health.

If it was up to me, I'd prosecute anti-vaxxers, but that ship has already sailed.

 

Offline starlord

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
In theory I agree, but that’s provided you have enough masks to go around. If not, better to reroute those masks in health where they can do the most good by trained people who can then do their job of keeping other people healthy.

It’s also a cultural thing: many people have discouraged people from wearing masks in France due to 2 things:

One is a subset of people tend to become panicky as a result.

The second is another subset of people tend to later be laxist on other matters (minimum distance security, hands hygiene,etc...)

So it really isn’t as clear cut as this.

 

Offline 666maslo666

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Passive masks such as surgical grade masks are only effective in preventing your spittle from infecting others, but sadly will be inadequate at filtering outside contaminants. So, if the fact of wearing a mask isn’t followed unanimously, then it’s pretty much useless, which is one of the reasons why there was so much talk about rerouting masks to health authorities in France, despite public uproar.

Any mask which doesn't cover all the soft tissue membranes is ineffective.   So full face respirators or filtered respirator and swimming goggles is the only way you'll keep it out of a head based entry as everyone seems to forget the eyes.. . 😂
All an unfiltered cloth mask (like all these homemade ones with lovely patterns I'm seeing flood social media) does, is after a few minutes of normal breathing, it creates a humid panel in front of your mouth and nose which makes an excellent dragnet for everything to adhere to.

Ok, here we go again... 

First let me say that science on this is not really settled and very hard to conclusively settle one way or another. However, Coronavirus is a droplet infection. Those droplets are significantly larger than individual virions and even homemade cloth mask worn haphazardly may be able to stop a lot of them. As you said, it could be a good dragnet. So there is certain logic behind wearing those masks even if nobody else does. Also, viral dose may matter so even an imperfect protection may be better than no protection. You can be assured that any healthcare personnel, if faced with the choice, would wear a homemade cloth mask rather than nothing. So you should probably as well.

EDIT: nice overview of the situation here in Slovakia. red = infected, blue = cured, dark blue = dead

« Last Edit: May 13, 2020, 07:06:50 am by 666maslo666 »
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
If it's not airtight, it's not right.  Sure using a pan to bail water from a sinking rowboat is better than nothing.  But a sieve is next to useless.   

The science may not be settled if you say, but I can stick to my opinion and let you stick to yours without conflict 👍

 

Offline Det. Bullock

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
If it's not airtight, it's not right.  Sure using a pan to bail water from a sinking rowboat is better than nothing.  But a sieve is next to useless.   

The science may not be settled if you say, but I can stick to my opinion and let you stick to yours without conflict %uD83D%uDC4D

Droplets (the occasional clumps of snot, saliva and other stuff we spit out while we breathe or speak) are bigger than air molecules, though.
Reasoning they are useless it's like certain arguments people made back when they finally made helmets compulsory for scooters here: "but if a scooter accident happens in a certain way the helmet is useless!" they said, missing the point that at least you got some protection in the case the accident happens in other "certain ways", better partial protection than no protection.
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
It's the false confidence the general public associate with them here that causes flocking in supermarkets that grips my ****.  They assume its a lucifer style sheath shield and walk well within my personal space leaving me little room to manoeuvre despite protest.

 

Offline starlord

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Precisely the point dekker makes.

The masks are not useless and do provide some form of protection.

However that protection is not absolute and people should recognise this while using them, and continue to enforce remaining protective measures.

My point here is that by failing to do so, the masks utility is being wasted, and it is a precious resource.

As previously said, contrary to popular belief, this is no lucifer sheath shield.

 

Offline 666maslo666

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
My point here is that by failing to do so, the masks utility is being wasted, and it is a precious resource.

Regarding mask scarcity, that is why countries with compulsory masking recommend using primarily reusable, washable cloth masks (can quite easily be made even at home if you can sew). Or even bandanas. Not disposable surgical masks or N95 respirators, those are best left for healthcare professionals.
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Offline Rhymes

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
A reminder to everyone here. Face masks other than N95s DO NOT protect you from other people’s germs. They protect other people from your germs. Wear your ****ing mask. Protect the people around you.
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
And stay at home.   👍👍

 

Offline The E

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Remember some millennia ago, when certain political figures were suddenly on the hype train for a drug named hydroxychloroquine?

Here's where that nonsense came from.

Quote
President Donald Trump’s obsession with the anti-malarial drug hydroxychloroquine as a treatment for the coronavirus may have started in part because of a self-described philosopher in China who is a fan of white nationalists, tweets anti-Semitic rhetoric and calls chloroquine “a Nazi drug that is here to teach a lesson to leftists about bias.”

Yeah, there's everything in there. Some grifters posting ****, some more influential grifters picking it up and signal-boosting it, media that reports stuff that originates from within their ideological sphere unchallenged and unvetted.....
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Online Su-tehp

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Sometimes I still can't believe that I lived to see a moron like Donald Trump become the greatest con man in history (never mind the President of the United States), but this is where we are. I almost feel sorry for the people taken in by his cons, but then I remember that they voted for him and are getting the least of what they deserve.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2020, 08:19:04 pm by Su-tehp »
Creator of the Devil and the Deep Blue campaign - Current Story Editor of the Exile campaign

"Let my people handle this, we're trained professionals. Well, we're semi-trained, quasi-professionals, at any rate." --Roy Greenhilt,
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"Let´s face it, we Freespace players may not be the most sophisticated of gaming freaks, but we do know enough to recognize a heap of steaming crap when it´s right in front of us."
--Su-tehp, while posting on the DatDB internal forum

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Offline Dysko

Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Italy is now 2 weeks into the relaxed lockdown, and from tomorrow the lockdown is expected to be relaxed further due to no increase in new daily cases since the rule relaxation.
...which is not quite clever with a 2 weeks incubation period.

While the outbreak is mostly contained in many regions, the Lombardy clusterf**k will be a problem, since we are getting more than 50% of the new daily cases in the whole country, and still we do not know who is actually infected.

Other regions have started massive screening programs to map the outbreak. Lombardy instead says "F**k you. Do you want to be tested? Pay for the test yourself!" (Lombardy healthcare system is quite different from the rest of Italy, since it heavily relies on private facilities, much more than the rest of the country).

And despite having one of the highest death ratios WORLDWIDE, few days ago the Lombardy governor said that the region was the best one in containing the outbreak  :blah:

Masks are compulsory now, but I still see many people wearing them without covering the nose, or removing them to chat better  :wtf:
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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
Masks are compulsory now, but I still see many people wearing them without covering the nose, or removing them to chat better  :wtf:

Reeeeeee but people can still hear you fine through a mask aaaaaaaa

 

Offline Stealth

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Re: Coronavirus Outbreak
A reminder to everyone here. Face masks other than N95s DO NOT protect you from other people’s germs. They protect other people from your germs. Wear your ****ing mask. Protect the people around you.
Yeah what he said.

These masks (or "face coverings" - using a bandana, etc) are not designed or even IMPLIED to protect YOU.  They protect EVERYONE ELSE FROM YOU.
And the logic goes - if everyone around you is also wearing a mask, then the chances of you getting infected go way down.
Same concept as surgeons - they don't want to infect the guy lying on the operating table, so they wear surgical masks, not N95s.