Author Topic: rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed  (Read 40394 times)

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Offline Taristin

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
I was thinking the detail thing... but unfortunately, that would stop me from making models... seeing as I can't do high-poly, greeble stuff...


But it would be cool to put my Anuket in. :drevil:  But how are we going to convert such high-poly models? I try and PCS crashes...
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Offline Galemp

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Quote
Originally posted by Raa Tor'h
But how are we going to convert such high-poly models? I try and PCS crashes...


Good point.

Perhaps Bob's going to force us all to use Aurora... in any case, Aurora, Modelview, PCS and quite likely FRED are going to need overhauls to use this technology too.
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Offline Bobboau

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Aurora, doesn't convert, though it is better at editing than it was, I think I fixed the little bug with the mass and stuff
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Offline KARMA

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
I think that it may be a good idea to add a superdetailed lod for external views and tech descriptions renders (the spinning ships). I also know that you can convert up to 6 lods by now, but kazan said that fs2 will use only the first 4, if he's right you probably should enable the two additional lods.
About textures, from what you said it would be good to have the max number possible of polys mapped with the single texture. Now, I was wondering, what if I have a ship with for example 10 textures (few polys of a single ships mapped with same texture), but those textures are shared between many (different)ships at the same moment (a lot of polys from different ships at the same time)?

 

Offline Bobboau

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
it still won't like it any better, becase it will have to break up each model and set the current texture and render each texture of each model one at a time, and the thing that realy slows down (relitivly) a HT&L system is changeing the current texture, though honestly, even if you make a ship that has 16 diferent texture in 20 diferent subobjects, it's still going to be way faster than it used to be, it just could be even better if you kept this in mind
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Offline karajorma

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Hmmm. Time to bite the bullet and learn to use Lith methinks :D

Even if I don't need to I want to make more efficient ships so I can have more of them :D
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Offline J3Vr6

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
So, I don't think I've seen this anywhere:  Are the FS2 ships from the Campaign have any issues with this?
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Offline Nico

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Quote
Originally posted by Styxx
Alternatively, someone could bake textures for all current FS/FS2 ships and reconvert them, and have only a single, really high-res map for each ship. I suppose that would speed things up even further.


huh? and who would redo all the UV mappings? Find somebody who is willing to do that, and do it well, and I send you coockies, real ones :p
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Offline Gloriano

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Quote
Originally posted by Venom


huh? and who would redo all the UV mappings? Find somebody who is willing to do that, and do it well, and I send you coockies, real ones :p




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Offline Nico

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
I said "willing" :p
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Offline aldo_14

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Wonder how many people will actually use this, though..... i mean, I'd like to, but I've already done at least half of the ships for Reci to be within the old limits..........

 

Offline LtNarol

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Does this mean we can put more ships in a mission without it crashing as well?

 

Offline aldo_14

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Quote
Originally posted by LtNarol
Does this mean we can put more ships in a mission without it crashing as well?


I think that may depend on memory limits as much as the rendering engine.....IIRC there's a predefined set limit for ships in a mission.  On the other hand, it'd mean you could meet that limit will a lot better performance :)

 

Offline karajorma

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Quote
Originally posted by aldo_14
Wonder how many people will actually use this, though..... i mean, I'd like to, but I've already done at least half of the ships for Reci to be within the old limits..........


I'm already building new stuff with this in mind :D

I doubt I'll improve my older models though. It seems like a waste of time to redo old models (Not that I have many to redo!).

Actually while I'm here one more question. Has this upgrade gotten rid of some of the other restrictions like non-flat faces, vertices in a line, irregular shaped polys where you can't draw a line between vertices without leaving the poly?
 All of those caused moving textures/holes in FS2. Do they still?
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Offline Vasudan Admiral

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
erm, could the texture limit per object possibly be bumped to 30 or so? :nervous:

i've checked and i have 4 complex models that break the limit, but they _really_ can't lose any textures, plus they are fully pofed and pathed & tbled for the most part. and i really don't have time to redo them. :(
i am also quite sure these aren't the only ships in the community this would break, although they are probably the ones that are the main secret in many campaigns.

how much of a slowdown would be caused by bumping this limit? and would it only occur only in the missions involving these complex ships, or in any mission with that limit defined in the exe?


other than that, this is simply THE BEST NEWS I HAVE HEARD IN AGES!!!!!!!!!!
:D :eek2: :yes: :eek: :D

*goes off to party*

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Offline Bobboau

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
all models are triangulated durring load, and non flat faces will be fixed there, it actualy would be sort of a good idea to have non flat faces, as this would be a smaller file and load quicker (though the amount by wich it does so would probly be insignifigant)

and unless there are a lot of people who need this raised I'd rather not as it would raise the memory requirements (for storing the actual segments of the ship, not the textures) and there will be a considerable slow down for ships that have too many textures (note, there is a monsterus (were talking 80 foot radioactive reptile here) slowdown in the old rendering code as every poly gets drawen individualy and the texture gets changed every other poly)

but then again, most people's models won't need to be optomised to that level, under no situation will you ever have a model that renders slower in the HT&L engine than the old engine, saying there will be a slowdown is a bit miss leading, it's more like you'd have just slightly less of a speed up

also if you don't want to remake you're old models for this, that's fine thely just render an order of magnatude faster than they used to
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Offline Galemp

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
Great! Wonderful! Thanks for clearing that up, Bobboau.

So, what we have now will run fine. But in the future, don't go berserk on the textures; right? Cool!

Now, back to conversions... what would need to be done to FRED, PCS and ModelView to get them to support these new models?
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Offline Bobboau

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
fred, fred might actualy be a problem, didn't even think about fred. not sure, hopefully it'll work :)

PCS kazan needs to look into what his code doese at insainly high poly counts

model view needs to have it's limits raised
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Offline Vasudan Admiral

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
awesome! :D

*does dance of joy*

*runs off to make high poly stuff*

oh and i bumped modviews limits a while back:
here if anyone's interested :)
all face and vert limits are somewhere in the 100 000 to the 1 000 000 range IIRC :)
(not sure how well it would run under those conditions tho :nervous: )
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Offline Galemp

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rejoice modelers, you're limits have been killed
FRED should be forced to use LOD1, methinks. You'll never see all that detail in FRED and it would help things along significantly.
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