[diamondgeezer]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/wtwtgod/default.stm

Pick a topic therin and discuss. First member to insult another is a rotten egg. Sorry if the poll doesn't cover you, but I only get 10 choices and there's a helluva lot of splinter factions out there

[aldo_14]

Aetheist.  Although i don't discount the existnece of a higher power, i just don;t think it matters - surely how you live your life is more important than how you pray?  And after all, some of the worst atrocities in history were committed in the name of religion.....

[phreak]

why didn't you put in Odin/Thor and all those norse gods.  Well there is an "Other" option....

Actually its somewhere between agnostic, money and science. (i wouldn't call the last two "worshipping" though)

[JC Denton]

Yeah, count me in with Aldo there.  I'm sure there's some higher order than humanity, and so far, there's not been proof enough of a scientific nature to either discount or confirm the existence of God.  So, I consider myself undecided.

Though, if I may take a reference from Babylon 5, is it possible some elder species may have altered our development very early on, and to us they appear as "angels" or somesuch?  (Smacks of Vorlon 'tweaking' but it's as viable a theory as any I've heard)

[diamondgeezer]

Something that puts me right off religion, certainly organised religion, is my housemate who says I'm going to hell. He's very polite about it, and doesn't preach to us (and has only once made an attempt at converting me, and that was half-hearted at best) but if I ask him he'll tell me I'm going to the basement when I die.

He says it's not that I'm a particulalry bad person. Certainly he and his church buddies drink more than I do, and the only time I've heard him mention doing any charity work is when he was chatting to an attracive young lady (in a bar) - and even then he said he'd like to, if he had the time and financial security to get away from work.

Me, I give a bit of money to Amnesty and the occasional beggar. And I'm kind to animals. And I try to avoid blaspheming in front of my religious friends. But, says my housemate, since I don't acknowledge God as my lord and master, I'm ****ed. Apparently, even someone who devotes his or her entire life to helping others, never once putting their own well-being before those of a stranger, and maybe even sets a world record for charity and spreading peace - that person will still go to hell if they don't pray to God regularly. Which I think is a ****ty attitude, betwixt you and me. Granted, I don't care where he thinks I'm going after I pop me clogs, but to put more weight in prayer and church attendance before acts of love and charity is pathetic, IMO.


JC, you're thinking of Erich von Daniken's theroies there. I like the ideas, but the man screws himself over with dodgy 'facts', hypocrisy in accusing his critics of warping or discounting the evidence to fit the theory and then doing it himself, and flat refusing to bend his ideas or accept scientific fact when it disproves his case (also something he accuses his critics of). Despite all that, I'm quite happy with the concept of space travellers playing at gods and angels. Star Trek showed how easy it was in that episode with the primitive Vulcanoids - they refused to believe 'the Picard' was just a mortal man even when he told them straight to their faces, just as a human of 2000 years ago would have looked at an astronaut with a jetpack and automatically thought 'angel'

[JC Denton]

True, that, DG.

I've often wondered, _why_ do churches make such a big fuss about spreading their teachings (perfect example:  multiple mission trips to S. America, Africa, various third-world nations, etc..) and seem more intent in those endeavours than, say, chopping a bit of mission-tripping to help the disenfranchised here at home?  I mean, for all of America's relative wealth and 'good' standard of living, there's still a fair percentage of the population that is forced to call the streets home.

[diamondgeezer]

Originally posted by JC Denton
I mean, for all of America's relative wealth and 'good' standard of living, there's still a fair percentage of the population that is forced to call the streets home.

More than you know. Amnesty send me all this bumpf that I don't want every month, and they claim that the Brazillian government, in order to prevent street urchins adversely affecting the tourism industry, uses teams of soldiers to clean the streets at night with their rifles. They say they want Brazil to stop it or face international exposure.

Note to our Brazillian members - direct any hate mail to Amnesty International, not me.

[Nuke]

someone needs to write an atheist manifesto, that way, when someone bugs us about our chosen beliefs, we can quote em some bs passage to shut them up. i cant even go into a bar without some evangeletical mofo trying to convert me. ive chosen my faith (or should i say lack there of) leave me the phuck alone.

[Petrarch of the VBB]

I'm atheist, mostly because both my parents are.
I was sent to a faith school, though, simply because there weren't any non-faith ones.

I used to be quite militant in despising relgions, mainly Christianity, due to having it rammed down my throat from an early age, but I've become more tolerant and respectful in recent years. I have quite a deal of respect for Jews, because they've taken so much **** over the years.

I still find myself shaking my head despondently when I hear people citing creationism or the second coming etc.

[Nuke]

i like jews, they never bug me about religon

[kasperl]

well, let's say this, if there is a God, he (or she, or it) either
a) Hates me
b) Loves me, and is therefore not very competent
c) does not give a ****.

ergo, i don't care.  even if there is a higher being, i won't have proof untill I'm dead, so for now, i think there is none. If there is an afterlife it'll be a nice surprise.

on Religion in general:
note: everywhere where i say religion, faith or believe, is also mean the lack there of, ergo Atheïsm.
If someone beliefs in something, I'll respect him or her, as long as he or she doesn't try to force it on me or anyone else. Religion can be a great help to people, and it can make the do a lot of good as well. But if someone thinks they should try and convert as much people as possible, just to do "good" to secure their own place in whatever happy variant of afterlife they believe, it is bad. Wheter any belief is bad or not depends completely on the person acting on it's rules, not the rules it self.
If someone thinks they should fly a plain into a building, or prohibit someone else from marrying someone from the same sex, just on the basis of faith, the person is wrong. But if the same faith is used to set up schools, collect for charity's, or help people in poverty see hope, it is good.

bottom line: Religion good, People bad.

[Woolie Wool]

I'm atheist.

[karajorma]

Originally posted by Nuke
someone needs to write an atheist manifesto, that way, when someone bugs us about our chosen beliefs, we can quote em some bs passage to shut them up. i cant even go into a bar without some evangeletical mofo trying to convert me. ive chosen my faith (or should i say lack there of) leave me the phuck alone.

Don't need one. The best points of aethism is that most of us arrive at our beliefs by ourselves rather than having them beaten into us at an early age from an external source.

[Woolie Wool]

[kasperl]

While writing i saw another few posts, so here's another bit of my worthless opinion.

I do not respect, or disrespect, anyone on the basis of his or her faith. Just because someone is a Jew, it doesn;t mean that that person is any better or worse then a Christian or a Muslim. Sure, the Jews have been the target of an awfull lot of hate, and they have been the universal scapegoat since the time of the Roamn emperors (probably earlier, not sure). But those persons aren't alive today, so why should i take those facts of history in consideration when considering the actions of a Jew today? There is no reason, everyone should be judged on his or her own actions, not those of their ancestors. The same thing goes for the generalisations of people who act on the same faith. Just because someone is Christian, doesn't mean that person would start damaging abortion clinics. Once again, judge every man or woman for his or her own actions.

[01010]

If you'd have asked me this a year ago I was a definite aetheist, God did not exist and I could accept that.

Now, though nothings really changed in my life (and I certainly wouldn't ever consider joining an organised religion) I tend to think a little differently, like maybe there is a God.

Most certainly I feel that if there is a God, he'd almost certainly not be the wrathful vengeance bearing God that most religions harp on about either. Why create beings with free will and sentience only to impose strict rules on what they can and cannot do? I don't think that God would discriminate against people with no faith either as long as they were good people (like DG says) as he would have unconditional love for all his children.

Personally, I see religion as an outdated method of populace control which is unecessary, we have T.V for that now.

[Petrarch of the VBB]

I'll not try and suggest that that was directed at me, but all the same. Jews get my respect for sticking to Judaism. If they act like utter twats otherwise, then they won't.
Anyone who carries on with anything in the face of great adversity deserves a measure of respect, especially people still using Windows 3.1.

[Petrarch of the VBB]

Originally posted by 01010
Personally, I see religion as an outdated method of populace control which is unecessary, we have T.V for that now.

Reminds me of when you speak to that AI in Deus Ex (I forget its name. Could be Morpheus), and it talks of government surveillance being the replacement for religion.

And I agree with that, religion being the basis behind the majority of laws, and thus, populace control, as you say.

[Martinus]

[color=66ff00]Ohhh, just you wait 'til Kazan sees this thread, then by god there'll be hell to pay.

Maeglamor believes in the perfect ideal "each to his own".
[/color]

[Corsair]

Originally posted by Nuke
i like jews, they never bug me about religon

*worships God but not Jesus*

I'm Jewish. And my desktop has Windows 95.

I don't exactly agree with what Nuke said though. Maybe most Jews don't bug people about religion because they're either reform or conservative. If you get to know some of the more religious Jews though, you'll see that they are extreme in their beliefs. While they may not actively try to convert people like the missionaries of old, they exert a whole lot of power in Israel. Political power.
At least it seems that way sometimes. I don't know Israeli politics that well, and it confuses me sometimes. Sandwich would know a lot more than me.