Author Topic: 3 Bombs go off in London  (Read 14820 times)

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Offline Nuclear1

  • 211
Now it's time for my delayed reaction.

When I heard about what had happened, I went into shock. Then again, the British people (not just Blair here, but the Londoners who took the **** and the rest of the British people) have shown that I don't have a reason to. The attacks were horrible and cowardly, and the people who did it deserve to burn in hell. But, if there's one thing that I really admire about the British people, it's that they stand up like real men (figuratively speaking) and don't let things like this shake them.  Hang in there, England--whoever did this **** is going down one way or another. ;)

And to dan, Flip, and all the other Londoners on this forum or otherwise: we're glad you're safe, and I want to join America in wishing that your country recovers quickly and stays strong. :)
« Last Edit: July 08, 2005, 05:40:10 pm by 673 »
Spoon - I stand in awe by your flawless fredding. Truely, never before have I witnessed such magnificant display of beamz.
Axem -  I don't know what I'll do with my life now. Maybe I'll become a Nun, or take up Macrame. But where ever I go... I will remember you!
Axem - Sorry to post again when I said I was leaving for good, but something was nagging me. I don't want to say it in a way that shames the campaign but I think we can all agree it is actually.. incomplete. It is missing... Voice Acting.
Quanto - I for one would love to lend my beautiful singing voice into this wholesome project.
Nuclear1 - I want a duet.
AndrewofDoom - Make it a trio!

 

Offline Ford Prefect

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Quote
Originally posted by nuclear1

...it's that they stand up like real men and don't let things like this shake them.
[/B]
That's not a very nice way to talk about the British girls. Some of them are quite lovely.
"Mais est-ce qu'il ne vient jamais à l'idée de ces gens-là que je peux être 'artificiel' par nature?"  --Maurice Ravel

 

Offline Nuclear1

  • 211
Post edited. :nervous:
Spoon - I stand in awe by your flawless fredding. Truely, never before have I witnessed such magnificant display of beamz.
Axem -  I don't know what I'll do with my life now. Maybe I'll become a Nun, or take up Macrame. But where ever I go... I will remember you!
Axem - Sorry to post again when I said I was leaving for good, but something was nagging me. I don't want to say it in a way that shames the campaign but I think we can all agree it is actually.. incomplete. It is missing... Voice Acting.
Quanto - I for one would love to lend my beautiful singing voice into this wholesome project.
Nuclear1 - I want a duet.
AndrewofDoom - Make it a trio!

 

Offline pyro-manic

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:lol: You tell 'im, Ford!

I think most people here haven't been overly fazed by this purely because we're used to it (as kara said, anyone over 30 has lived with terrorism more than without it). And the whole "stiff-upper-lip" thing still applies somewhat, even with all the nannying of recent years.

We've got more to fear from our own government than we have from terrorists, to be honest - they're capable fo doing some real damage...
Any fool can pull a trigger...

 

Offline vyper

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Namely ID cards.
"But you live, you learn.  Unless you die.  Then you're ****ed." - aldo14

 

Offline pyro-manic

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Got it in one. Though I suspect they're cooking up even more oppressive goodies for us after this...
Any fool can pull a trigger...

 

Offline Rictor

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Yeah, that's always been my opinion regarding terrorism. It's bad, in that it can kill people, but that's pretty much it. The true goal is to influence a political change, and in any Western country there is simply no chance of that. Any proper war, be it a small ethnic/civil war or counterinsurgency or whatever, can and has kill many more people than all recent terrorist attacks combined, by orders of magnitude.

 

Offline Kosh

  • A year behind what's funny
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The bottom line is that Aldo is right.


Sometimes you use the stick, but sometimes you need to use the carrot.
"The reason for this is that the original Fortran got so convoluted and extensive (10's of millions of lines of code) that no-one can actually figure out how it works, there's a massive project going on to decode the original Fortran and write a more modern system, but until then, the UK communication network is actually relying heavily on 35 year old Fortran that nobody understands." - Flipside

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Offline Ford Prefect

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Ah yes, I believe it was Roosevelt who said, "Walk softly but carry a big carrot." Err, no no, it was, "Tie a carrot to your big stick to make the mule walk softly" Eh, no that wasn't it.... "Ride the mule softly, but with a carrot on a big stick...." Eh, I dunno.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2005, 12:37:12 am by 2015 »
"Mais est-ce qu'il ne vient jamais à l'idée de ces gens-là que je peux être 'artificiel' par nature?"  --Maurice Ravel

 

Offline Liberator

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This ends one of two ways:

1)the peaceniks win and we talk our way out of it

2)we kill all the mullahs and other "clerics" who preach and indoctriate their hate as a means of control

The latter is far, FAR more likely to happen.
So as through a glass, and darkly
The age long strife I see
Where I fought in many guises,
Many names, but always me.

There are only 10 types of people in the world , those that understand binary and those that don't.

 

Offline karajorma

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Name one time where military action has ended terrorism.

I named three cases where terrorism ended through social change so you should be able to name at least one.
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Offline Kosh

  • A year behind what's funny
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Quote
Originally posted by Liberator
This ends one of two ways:

1)the peaceniks win and we talk our way out of it

2)we kill all the mullahs and other "clerics" who preach and indoctriate their hate as a means of control

The latter is far, FAR more likely to happen.



1.) You mean letting the reasonable people win?


2.) Kill them, and more will just appear to take their place. So you just end up right back where you started. So what next? Keep killing? Then they will just keep coming.
"The reason for this is that the original Fortran got so convoluted and extensive (10's of millions of lines of code) that no-one can actually figure out how it works, there's a massive project going on to decode the original Fortran and write a more modern system, but until then, the UK communication network is actually relying heavily on 35 year old Fortran that nobody understands." - Flipside

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Offline Blaise Russel

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Quote
Originally posted by Liberator
This ends one of two ways:

1)the peaceniks win and we talk our way out of it

2)we kill all the mullahs and other "clerics" who preach and indoctriate their hate as a means of control

The latter is far, FAR more likely to happen.


Would you care to give an estimate as to the number of people we will have to kill to put a permanent end to terrorism? Specifically, Islamic fundamentalist terrorism? Specifically, anti-Western, anti-globalisation culture terrorism? Specifically, an entire sub-continent terrorism?

Genocide, sir?

 

Offline Rictor

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Liberator does have a point, and I think most people realize that for certain individuals negotiation is futile, force is the only answer. The two are equally imporant. A majority of the support base can be removed through political and economic means, by taking away the legitimate grievances, but some people do in fact consider it a holy war, so the size of the carrot is irrelevant, because they are not after the carrot.

The success of the stick approach depends on the success of the carrot.

 

Offline Flipside

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I just love the way that 'Republican' and 'Peacenik' have somehow been turned into insults. If you actually stop and look at the meaning of both those words, you'd realise how silly that is ;)

 

Offline aldo_14

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Quote
Originally posted by Liberator
This ends one of two ways:

1)the peaceniks win and we talk our way out of it

2)we kill all the mullahs and other "clerics" who preach and indoctriate their hate as a means of control

The latter is far, FAR more likely to happen.


No it's not.  You can see already it's doing the complete opposite - just ask the CIA.

Again you're attempting to divide this complex issue into a black and white scenario with only 2 choices.  Seeing the world in that way has never worked; not only that, it becomes a complete abdication of responsibility - you only need to say the 'only other' alternative is impossible and then give yourself carte blanche.

Have you considered why there are people preaching against the west? (not that this is necessarily equivalent to recruitment to terrorist / jihadist groups - disliking or even hating the US and soforth does not automatically make someone a terrorist, as much as you may like it to)  

Or why people listen?

I mean, it's not because we live in democratic secular societies (at least, not for the majority - there's a lways a bunch of nutters, same as we have racists or bigots in every other country) - it's the arrogance of Us foreign policy that causes schisms.  And 'arrogance' is lifted directly off of a report from an indepedent federal advisorty comittee that provides advice to the DoD.

I'm sure most people remember this quote;
[q]'Muslims do not hate our freedom, but rather they hate our policies [the report says]. The overwhelming majority voice their objections to what they see as one-sided support in favor of Israel and against Palestinian rights, and the long-standing, even increasing, support for what Muslims collectively see as tyrannies, most notably Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Pakistan and the Gulf states. Thus, when American public diplomacy talks about bringing democracy to Islamic societies, this is seen as no more than self-serving hypocrisy.'[/q]

Incidentally, how do you plan on killing all these clerics? How are the local people going to feel when you do so?  Are they going to go 'oh, the West must be good; they come in and kill these religious leaders we go to the mosque to listen to'?

 

Offline Black Wolf

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Quote
Originally posted by Swamp_Thing

Look at Spain. Spain had never been attacked by islamic fundies before.


Unless you count the Moors... :nervous:
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Offline Kosh

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Quote
A majority of the support base can be removed through political and economic means, by taking away the legitimate grievances, but some people do in fact consider it a holy war, so the size of the carrot is irrelevant, because they are not after the carrot.


Liberator's answer to anything is force. He doesn't understand how the world REALLY works, and it doesn't look like he wants to. He just doesn't see the big picture.
"The reason for this is that the original Fortran got so convoluted and extensive (10's of millions of lines of code) that no-one can actually figure out how it works, there's a massive project going on to decode the original Fortran and write a more modern system, but until then, the UK communication network is actually relying heavily on 35 year old Fortran that nobody understands." - Flipside

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Offline TrashMan

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You need BOTH force and a carrot.

The problem can't be solved by mearly one of them.. that is unless, everyone in the US and the world would be willing to convert to Islam and accpet the strict laws - as there will allways be a few of those fanatical warriors who will see any other religion as a blight.

sure, most people who support terrorist do so becosue of their social status and blame it on others..and becose of the attitude of the Us....at least that's what I'm told..
Nobody dies as a virgin - the life ****s us all!

You're a wrongularity from which no right can escape!

 

Offline karajorma

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Quote
Originally posted by TrashMan
You need BOTH force and a carrot.


That's what pretty much everyone except for Liberator realises.
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