Author Topic: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****  (Read 17338 times)

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Offline Mikes

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
I remember the show to be incredibly idealistic at the time, for having the balls to say that even such nasty beings like the Borg have a place in the universe and no one should try to eradicate them, even if only in self defense.

Ah yeah good old Star Trek idealism ..... 

Nowadays we have Liu Cixin's "Dark Forest"

How times have changed.

 

Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
Dark Forest is amazing.

And Alex Kurtzman took over STD.

https://variety.com/2018/tv/news/star-trek-discovery-showrunners-alex-kurtzman-1202847342/

Well, that clenches the show for me. Bye!

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
:bump:

New episode appeared!!!

I have yet to watch it though :/
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Offline karajorma

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
The Orville is still better though. :p
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
I'm still waiting to watch season 2 of that as well  :p
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Offline The E

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
Saw the first episode of the new season.

It seems they pivoted the show hard, towards something more closely resembling traditional Star Trek. in terms of tone, this is a much more light-hearted show now; Captain Pike is snarky and approachable where Lorca was dark and mysterious. Everyone seems to be on board Tilly's "Being in space is ****ing awesome, y'all" attitude, and the show is much better for it.

It is not, however, perfect. Sonequa Martin-Green still has to carry the show, and while she's better at it now than she was in S1, the script isn't doing her any favours by kinda hammering us over the head with how smart she is. I think the writers could stand to be a tad more subtle in that regard, you know?

Still though, good Trek.
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Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
Genius woman who knows everything is almost a star trek staple since Voyager debuted...

 

Offline The E

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
I think we've been watching very different shows, again.
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
I wouldn't worry.   I'm three episodes in and it's getting the same old feel.  Not a bad thing but you can see the loose threads tie themselves off in advance.   A  r3dshirt moment I expected didn't happen but then kinda did anyway so that was semi-true.


No spoilers but you'll get your sinister feels back later the E :yes:
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Offline The E

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
No spoilers but you'll get your sinister feels back later the E :yes:

To be clear, I am not actually missing those. I don't think they're a necessary component of a good Trek show, and I'm perfectly fine with Discovery pivoting towards being more lighthearted.

My main complaint so far, that the script presents Burnham as too competent, is a bit more subtle. In all previous Trek shows, we had characters presented as being supremely competent in their respective fields; the premise being that if you weren't, you wouldn't be part of the main cast. However, because those were ensemble shows, competency was spread around more. In this first episode, we see Burnham confidently taking charge of a difficult portion of an away mission, quietly and confidently rebuking a new Captain when he inadvertently calls Discovery's commitment to doing the right thing into question, all stuff any other Starfleet officer we've seen over the years would've done.
The problem is that those traits, especially confidence, is wholly given to Burnham. The rest of the Bridge crew gets the scenes of doubting themselves, of not being sure whether they can pull something off that Burnham skips; this, to me, makes the whole dynamic of the crew feel unbalanced. I know that this is by design, but given that this season begins with including the rest of the cast to a much greater degree, it feels a bit weird.
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Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
I think we've been watching very different shows, again.

I was being facetious and mostly mocking Caretaker and how much those episodes annoyed me. I agree with you on Burnham and can already spider-sense all the hatedom picking that up as well. Oh well. I expect this season to fail a lot more than the last, purely from whom is at the writing helm. I also agree with the your take on the lighter tone, and I wished it was more like that. I enjoyed Pike so far, and especially his tactful manner in which he wins the Discovery crew over to his side, but given some rumours, I'm already eye-rolling to what is going to happen next.

 

Offline 0rph3u5

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
My main complaint so far, that the script presents Burnham as too competent,

So, I just finished the first two episodes.... and I am from the first one I am picking up the same thing as you do, but I can't help but see it as a from of set-up for the later -- the whole "make a character stand on a chair so they can fall off something"-trick...

This is further reinforced in the second epsiode when the speculation about the "red bursts" truely begins and stuff happens - the writers seems to be laying groundwork so that to Burham & Co the mystery can meaningfully defy their understanding - for that, we needed a baseline what the limits of their understanding are; and in doing so they might have gone over-the-top.

"When you work with water, you have to know and respect it. When you labour to subdue it, you have to understand that one day it may rise up and turn all your labours into nothing. For what is water, which seeks to make all things level, which has no taste or colour of its own, but a liquid form of Nothing?" - Graham Swift, Waterland

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Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
Did you notice that the main engineer is looking to leave?

Well guess what folks........
I wouldn't be surprised if a new engineer turns up where you least / most expect them to.
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Offline Rhymes

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
Despite having been a Star Trek nerd my whole life, I...didn't really care very much about Discovery after about the halfway mark of the first season. I finally canceled my subscription last week because I realized I wasn't going to actually watch the show anytime soon.  It's not that I hate it--there's clearly a lot of effort and money being put into this, and it shows, but it just...doesn't grab me. It was nice for the first couple of episodes to have new Star Trek on TV, but part of the problem is that I don't have a whole lot of time or mental bandwidth to devote to a bunch of TV shows--I have enough time and focus for one show, basically, and for me, it's The Expanse. For Discovery to replace it, it'd have to be better than that, and I think The Expanse is superb. Discovery is...only okay.

They've got a big budget and a very talented cast, but the writing is middling, many of the characters (especially the antagonists) are not very three-dimensional, and while I don't give a wet **** about whether Discovery looks too different from a 52-year-old TV show, the spore drive concept is unbelievably silly and fundamental to the first season. I can handle a certain amount of silliness--not everything needs to be diamond-hard sci-fi, but when it's a fundamental part of the story arc, I think there needs to be a certain acknowledgement of "yeah, this doesn't make one damn bit of sense." That was something I liked about some of the worldbuilding for Star Trek Online, of all things--while that game's storyline has many problems, the way it handled the 2387 supernova that wiped out Romulus was basically "yeah, stars should not be doing that, something screwy happened." For me, The Expanse has not only the budget (for polish) and the talent, but also much tighter writing, depth to spare for all its characters (even the literal sociopaths), and when it decides to throw something bonkers at the audience, it leans into the "wait, what the ****," reaction, rather than trying to ignore it. Again, it's not that I think Discovery's bad, but the constraints of real life force me to be extremely selective, and Discovery, at the moment, is unfortunately just not good enough.

Maybe if there's a big blu-ray box set or amazon release or something way down the line I'll pick it up when I have the bandwitdth to spare. I hope that the show does well this season, and that the cast and crew learn from their mistakes. What I saw of season 1 was certainly a damn sight better than TNG, Voyager, or Enterprise's first seasons, and that suggests potential. I didn't see flashes of brilliance like what DS9's first season had, nor the consistent high quality (given the era) of TOS's first season (arguably its best), but it seemed a decent start.
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Offline The E

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
Saw episode 2.

This is the most "classic Trek" episode Disco has done so far, and it felt really good. It's nice to see how Burnham's strengths turned out to be weaknesses in this episode (her utter dedication to facts and the provable leading her to be very r/atheism when confronted with people who, for very good reasons, have turned to religion). If there's something to complain about, it's that the basic A/B plots are things we've already seen done in Trek several times over. However, I feel like that's not the point of the story: The interesting thing isn't the situation, it's how this crew decides to react to it (just as, for example, the plot of a generic sports movie isn't important, it's how the characters in that story act).

Also, Dad Saru best Saru.
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
I like pike.   He could work with me in EOD.    I don't say that about many people.
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Offline Luis Dias

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
I agree with you. Best crew in Disco so far, and I do appreciate that they are building on top of what is now the new structure of star trek: an overarching mystery to unfold while having episodic stories. What used to be an "A/B" story mechanic is now a "Meta / Episode" structure, where the former feeds into the latter and vice-versa. It's very simple and effective, I can already see how next episodes can just be "where are new signals, there are new adventures", completing the whole puzzle with each piece. I hope they don't wreck this new "angel" character though (I'm still sure they will - it's incredible how often the antagonists are so poorly written in Trek).

 

Offline Buckshee Rounds

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
Inb4 Gul Dukat

Agree on episode 2, I'd say it was my favourite so far. It was a little derivative in that it leaned on some well established Trek formulas, but otherwise was actually quite enjoyable. Notably I think it had the least action/pew pew moments that I can recall.

What I hope is that they can build on the characters some more, give them more **** to do and stick to the episodic structure.

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
The crystal planet beacon episode was pretty un-pew-pew from what I recall but this one was less pew pew.  Only one phaser went off, but it was negligently.
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Offline karajorma

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Re: Star Trek Discovery -- This is the good ****
Meanwhile, the last episode of The Orville was ****ing adorable. I also thought there was a great moment in the one before. When I realised we were going to get a first contact episode I was pretty happy. And then it cut to the bridge crew, who were just as happy at the idea. Cause of course they should be over the moon at the idea.
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