[01010]

Originally posted by .::Tin Can::.
Ya know, I never, ever came into believing that you are "born gay"

Well tough **** cause theres a ****load of evidence pointing precisely 180 degrees from that opinion.

Would you maintain that the earth was flat if you believed it to be true? Despite evidence to the contrary?

Beliefs are ****ing stupid and the sooner people realise this the sooner we start going somewhere as a race rather than as groups of individuals.

[Rictor]

Does it matter? If you don't believe that people are born gay, and since there are obviously a ton of gays, then it must be society. And honestly, do you think you can shelter someone enought to negate the effect society has on them? Not without seriously warping them. So, whether they're born gay or turn gay, their chances are the same.

Originally posted by 01010
Beliefs are ****ing stupid and the sooner people realise this the sooner we start going somewhere as a race rather than as groups of individuals.

Thats like saying breathing is stupid, and the sooner we all stop the - oh **** *faints from lack of oxygen*

Seriously, everything is a belief. There s not evidence for anything that does not require some assumptions, so everything to believe is ultimately unprovable.

[01010]

Originally posted by Rictor

Thats like saying breathing is stupid, and the sooner we all stop the - oh **** *faints from lack of oxygen*

Seriously, everything is a belief. There s not evidence for anything that does not require some assumptions, so everything to believe is ultimately unprovable.

I don't see how your analogy works.

I'm saying that beliefs are stupid as they are beliefs, the very nature of them is that you don't require logic, or evidence (sounding like Kazan here ) you just believe them. You cannot tell me that people believing that gays are immoral for no other reason than a book (not even a deity, a second hand, re-written, vaguely worded book) tells them they are, it is a stupid belief.

An assumption is not a belief and an assumption is not something that most people should be drawing either. Assumptions are as stupid as beliefs unless they have the correct context.

[BlackDove]

Originally posted by Crazy_Ivan80


hardly, as has been said before: marriage predates religion. Marriage is also a mainly secular thing. Marrying in a church will yield you nothing legal if the state does not acknowledge the marriage.

And we both know that in practise, nobody gives a ****.

When you say "marriage" nobody associates it with the state. They associate it with a bunch of flowers, a veil, and in some cases, breaking of glasses.

Fact is that "marriage" ties directly into religions, and when certain "marriages" don't conform with the ideas of the general public practiscing those religions, the people freak.

That's what it means

[Stealth]

Depending on culture and religion marriage takes on many forms. I see no problem in having yet another form of marriage

what he's saying is that regardless of the many "forms" it takes... it always has been a man and a woman.  that's been the definition of marriage for as long as it's been around.

[jdjtcagle]

Times change, even if we hate change...

[BlackDove]

Originally posted by Stealth


what he's saying is that regardless of the many "forms" it takes... it always has been a man and a woman.  that's been the definition of marriage for as long as it's been around.

Because that has been the natural selection so far.

Fact is, we're overcrowding the planet. If indeed being homosexual is a trait given at birth, then I'd assume the gene pool is telling us that enough's enough as far as procreating goes, and that we're exceeding the limit.

Can't say I disagree really.  If you aren't going to shoot stupid people having kids because they like to have sex, I guess nature has to.

But to each his own. I have my stupid beliefs and you have yours.

[01010]

Originally posted by BD



Fact is, we're overcrowding the planet. If indeed being homosexual is a trait given at birth, then I'd assume the gene pool is telling us that enough's enough as far as procreating goes, and that we're exceeding the limit.

Ding ding ding, we have a winner. Welcome to my point of view, Population: Most of the rational sane people on the planet.

But seriously, I think a lot of people should really ponder on this one, it's the theory that would appear to make most sense.

[jdjtcagle]

That's indeed a interesting theory

[Stealth]

Originally posted by BD
But to each his own. I have my stupid beliefs and you have yours.

it's not a "stupid belief".  it's a fact.  marriage always has been between a man and a woman.  don't even try to start arguing that.  there's no room for "belief" there, and no room for "opinion" either.  marriage = man + woman.  bam.

although that theory about overpopulation is pretty interesting though.  worth a thought

[Mr. Vega]

Originally posted by Stealth


it's not a "stupid belief".  it's a fact.  marriage always has been between a man and a woman.  don't even try to start arguing that.  there's no room for "belief" there, and no room for "opinion" either.  marriage = man + woman.  bam.

although that theory about overpopulation is pretty interesting though.  worth a thought

What's the point of continuing this arguement if you just keep ignoring everything that has been said?

[.::Tin Can::.]

I guess in the next 10 or 30 years we will want polygamy to be legal, and after that we'll say that getting married to our own sisters and brothers, etc. It seems as our society gets older we become more lax at what becomes the standard. Today, its:

If it feels good, do it!

[jdjtcagle]

See that's one thing I don't get, what you see that the world is getting overpopulated so your gene pool starts popping out gay kids which causes a decrease in population?

What causes "natural selection" curious?

[Styxx]

Originally posted by Stealth
...it's a fact.  marriage always has been between a man and a woman.  don't even try to start arguing that...

Er, tell that to traditional muslims...

[Rictor]

Originally posted by 01010


I don't see how your analogy works.

I'm saying that beliefs are stupid as they are beliefs, the very nature of them is that you don't require logic, or evidence (sounding like Kazan here ) you just believe them. You cannot tell me that people believing that gays are immoral for no other reason than a book (not even a deity, a second hand, re-written, vaguely worded book) tells them they are, it is a stupid belief.
 

What I meant was, its all a closed system. For example:

I believe that gays are bad because God says so. How do I know God exists? I don't.

I believe the sky is blue becuase thats what my eyes tell me and what everyone else says. How do I know my eyes aren't decieving me, and that everyone else is not simply a figment of my imagination? I don't.

Even according to Decatres "I think therefore I am" theory, this only includes you, and its very non-specific.

but now we're getting into extisential matters and thats a discussion for another day.

[jdjtcagle]

I want to get in that argument Rictor

[jdjtcagle]

Originally posted by Styxx


Er, tell that to traditional muslims...

or Greeks

[jdjtcagle]

Originally posted by jdjtcagle
See that's one thing I don't get, what you see that the world is getting overpopulated so your gene pool starts popping out gay kids which causes a decrease in population?

What causes "natural selection" curious?

just in case you guys didn't see it...

I want an answer

[.::Tin Can::.]

Originally posted by Rictor

I believe the sky is blue becuase thats what my eyes tell me and what everyone else says. How do I know my eyes aren't decieving me, and that everyone else is not simply a figment of my imagination? I don't.

Actually there is science to help prove its blue color...

[jdjtcagle]

Doh...