[Destiny]

I'd put VSlashes on Deimoses since they use Vasudan reactors to make them more useful, eh. The Deimos and Aeolus are...quite the quintessential ships the GTVA needs beside those new shiny ones the Serkr ones are made up of.

Well Mars, maybe the ships have got more automation and stuff now to reduce crew and etc...?

[Mars]

I'd put VSlashes on Deimoses since they use Vasudan reactors to make them more useful, eh. The Deimos and Aeolus are...quite the quintessential ships the GTVA needs beside those new shiny ones the Serkr ones are made up of.

VSlashes aren't even supposed to be used in fours on the Sobek, that's like putting in BFReds all over the Colossus in High Noob.


EDIT:

Well Mars, maybe the ships have got more automation and stuff now to reduce crew and etc...?

Yeah, I would assume so, at the rate they lose Deimos crews in the Sol theater. Otherwise it'd be like losing a Orion every other mission.

PPS

I should clarify, I'm not trying to flame you, but I find your mispelling of High Noon decidedly humorous. It's nothing personal.

[PsychoLandlord]

Yeah, I get that the GTVA is used to hemorrhaging lives during combat, but if the crew count on those Corvettes is in any way proportional to their size, then the UEF  has probably managed to depopulate a few small colonies by now. Automation FTW.

[MatthTheGeek]

Wait wait wait. How many Deimoses do we see die in WiH ? There isn't THAT many of them. And definitely much less than we see Sanctus or Karunas die.

Also, remember that the hostilities have got a much more lively since Artemis. I guess the amount of combat we see in the whole WiH is probably as much as there was during the whole 18 months of stalemate. The GTVA didn't loose that many lives.

[Mars]

Way more Deimos's CAN die (than Karunas anyway). Hang on, let me look.

Potential GTVA losses in WiH, confirmed / unavoidable losses in RED

2nd Fleet 2nd Detachment
GTCv Leander - Deimos class
GTCv Legionary - Deimos class
GTCv Deianira - Deimos class
GTCv Iolanthe - Deimos class
GTCv Arethusa - Deimos class
GTC Voronezh - Aeolus class
GTC Joketsu - Aeolus class
GTC Grissom - Leviathan class
GTC Systema - Leviathan class

13th Battlegroup
GTCv Juarez - Deimos class
GTCV Redoubtable - Deimos class
GTCv Cardinal - Deimos class
GTCv Regensburg - Deimos class
GTCv Idomeneus - Deimos class
GTC Cho - Aeolus class
GTC Essex - Aeolus class
GTC Ajax - Aeolus class

15th Battlegroup
GTCv Siren - Chimera class
GTCv Medea - Diomedes class
GTCv Valarie - Diomedes class
GTC Elissa - Hyperion class
GTC Utica - Hyperion class





My point here is that the GTVA has the potential to take more losses than we see the Feds taking. They're ships are generally cheaper, that's BP canon, but I wonder about crew sizing.

[Commander Zane]

Yes they flee like the cowards they are.
Then kill everyone.

[Mars]

UEF Potential losses

Jovian Rim Fleet
FA 3311 Ranvir - Narayana class
FG 3101 Nelson - Karuna class
FG 3102 Cormorant - Karuna class
FG 3103 Katana - Karuna class
FG 3104 Altan Orde - Karuna class
FG 3107 Akula - Karuna class
FG 3108 Rhineland - Karuna class


CA 32XX Dea Nemetona - Sanctus class
CA 32XX St Vincent - Sanctus class
CA 32XX Dea Soucanna - Sanctus class
CA 32XX Sabaragamuwa - Sanctus class
CA 3240 Ironhide - Sanctus class
CA 3241 Suffron - Sanctus class
CA 3242 Dea Bricta - Sanctus class
CA 3243 Auxerre - Sanctus class


Second Fleet Mars
FG 2102 Yangtze - Karuna class


CA 2231 Dea Icaunis - Sanctus class
CA 2233 Kyoto - Sanctus class
CA 2234 Insuperable - Sanctus class

Home Fleet
CA 1225 Vilnius - Sanctus class

Unknown

X3XX - Narayana class
X3XX - Narayana class
X1XX - Karuna class
X1XX - Karuna class
X2XX - Sanctus class
X2XX - Sanctus class
X2XX - Sanctus class
X2XX - Sanctus class


So they DID lose more

[headdie]

GTVA                                                      UEF
GTCv Leander -Deimos class               FA 3311 Ranvir - Narayana class
GTCv Legionary -Deimos class               FG 3101 Nelson - Karuna class
GTCv Deianira -Deimos class               FG 3102 Cormorant - Karuna class
GTCv Iolanthe -Deimos class               FG 3103 Katana - Karuna class
GTCv Arethusa - Deimos class               FG 3104 Altan Orde - Karuna class
GTC Voronezh - Aeolus class               FG 3107 Akula -Karuna class
GTC Joketsu - Aeolus class               CA 32XX Dea Nemetona - Sanctus class
GTC Grissom - Leviathan class               CA 32XX St Vincent - Sanctus class
GTC Systema - Leviathan class            CA 32XX Dea Soucanna - Sanctus class
GTCv Juarez - Deimos class               CA 32XX Sabaragamuwa - Sanctus class
GTCV Redoubtable - Deimos class            CA 3240 Ironhide - Sanctus class
GTC Essex - Aeolus class                  CA 3241 Suffron - Sanctus class
GTC Ajax - Aeolus class                  CA 3242 Dea Bricta - Sanctus class
GTCv Siren - Chimera class               CA 3243 Auxerre - Sanctus class
GTCv Medea - Diomedes class               FG 2102 Yangtze - Karuna class
GTCv Valarie - Diomedes class               CA 2231 Dea Icaunis - Sanctus class
GTC Elissa - Hyperion class               CA 2233 Kyoto - Sanctus class
GTC Utica - Hyperion class               CA 2234 Insuperable - Sanctus class
                                                      CA 1225 Vilnius - Sanctus class


edit
readability

[The E]

Losing a frigate hurts the UEF a lot more than losing a Corvette does the GTVA.

[Mars]

GTVA potential losses
10 Deimos
2 Diomedes
1 Chimera
2 Hyperion
5 Aeolus
2 Leviathan
Total:
13 Corvettes
11 Cruisers

UEF potential losses
3 Narayana
9 Karuna
14 Sanctus
Total:
7 Frigates
16 Cruisers

58,000 Personnel


Yeah, I recall *tutta saying a Deimos is about 1/2 the cost of a Karuna for the GTVA.

EDIT:

I imagine those Tev cruisers are much cheaper as well. Those Leviathans are as old as the hills, and the Aeolous is supposed to be very cheap.

The real random numbers here are the costs of the newer ships. I do still wonder about crew sizes though.

[The E]

Don't forget, there are also losses that are only mentioned in the narrative and not seen on screen; those would add 3 Karunas and 2 Narayanas to the UEF losses.

[Mars]

Don't forget, there are also losses that are only mentioned in the narrative and not seen on screen; those would add 3 Karunas and 2 Narayanas to the UEF losses.

Oh shiz. . . I can't believe I didn't look at the narrative.

Also 1 Raynor + 1 Chimera + 1 Bellerophon + 1 Anemoi = 25,000

[Destiny]

Right, so...is the Indus going to be written off or fixed and put back into commission? Just theorizing, not fishing for information~

I should clarify, I'm not trying to flame you, but I find your mispelling of High Noon decidedly humorous. It's nothing personal.

Nah, I totally understand. Flamin' is bad, that zero tolerance policy up there says something.

[The E]

Right, so...is the Indus going to be written off or fixed and put back into commission? Just theorizing, not fishing for information~

Not gonna say. Wait and see.

[Mars]

Don't forget, there are also losses that are only mentioned in the narrative and not seen on screen; those would add 3 Karunas and 2 Narayanas to the UEF losses.

I actually can't find any but the Rhineland and four unnamed sub-frigate warships. I'll look again in the morning.

Right, so...is the Indus going to be written off or fixed and put back into commission? Just theorizing, not fishing for information~

I assume(d!) the Indus is was pretty much ****ed, but now I'll just have to wait and see.

Nah, I totally understand. Flamin' is bad, that zero tolerance policy up there says something.

I really don't try to flame people ever, but I take it to mean "be very, very careful. The ice, she is thin"

[The E]

Hmmm. I could have sworn all losses had been mentioned in the story. I was basing that off of our internal OrBat.

[Fury]

I actually think that the Hyperion is underused. It clearly should be the successor to Aeolus since they share the same mission profile. They both can perform as assault support with their forward firing beams and have ample coverage of turrets for anti-fighter job.

Hyperion's turrets 10-11 could be swapped to a weak variant of blue slasher beam, allowing Hyperion to perform in broadside combat support. Or turrets 8-9, 12-13 could be swapped to torpedo launchers for same mission role. You could change the multipart turrets to flak turrets, giving it better anti-fighter/-bomber interception at the expense of anti-bomb interception.

With little tweaks to Hyperion's armament it could serve in multiple roles, essentially replacing all previous Tev cruisers. They have the platform, why aren't they using it to its full potential? Hyperion is severely underestimated little bugger.

[Mars]

I personally find the Hyperion quite deadly as it is, especially in missions like The Plunder. If the player decides to journey out ahead over Medium, they're in for a rather rude surprise. STerPulse's are not to be toyed with. Also, playing around in a mission that I'm BADLY trying to make, I found an unchecked Hyperion took down a Sanctus with surprisingly little effort, to the point I had to rearrange the thing several times, and lower AI. I'm still trying to balance it properly.

I do think torpedo would be a cool, and I do like the broadside idea. The Aeoulus is only better in the anti-fighter role because it packs two fewer Terran Turret type blobs to add more flak. If the Hyperion only swapped out 2 Terran Turret 2s for STerPulses or something, it would probably be just as good.

There's also the perception that flak is better, just because it fills the players screen with bright exploding light. The pulse cannons are deadly, but not as visually noisy.

With little tweaks to Hyperion's armament it could serve in multiple roles, essentially replacing all previous Tev cruisers. They have the platform, why aren't they using it to its full potential? Hyperion is severely underestimated little bugger.

Isn't it because they're considered just plain too fragile?

IIRC you designed most of the weapons, didn't you Fury? Good a time as any to say that without exception they're pretty awesome.

[Mars]

Whoops, delayed double postage, sorry!

[MatthTheGeek]

The problem with the Hyperion is that it's a cruiser - which means that you don't need bombs or warships to take those out - and that it's a front-line ship, hence pretty expensive. You're better with your money building 2 Deimoses than 3 Hyperions. SBlues are better than SGreens (what isn't) but still suck and still have a very long recharge rate.

I expect Hyperions to be quickly superseeded by the Cretheus in its intended gunboat and warship escort role.