[an0n]

Originally posted by CODEDOG ND


Wrong, 2.67% for the human male, 3.02% for the human female.

[CODEDOG ND]

I looked it up, and women are smarter than men unfortunatly.

[Unknown Target]

Gah! Too many replies!!!!!!!!:D:eek:

And, no, the Holocaust was not about religion, it was instead about Hitler trying to shift the [righteous] blame for the economic decline to the Jews....

[an0n]

IT WASN'T JUST THE FRIGGIN JEWS!!!!!!!

It's just that 90% of the directors, producers and writters in Hollywood are jews and so they get all the attention.

[Unknown Target]

*cough, cough*
Yea, sorry, you're right, it's just that the Jews [I think] were the most, erm, persecuted?

[an0n]

Originally posted by Unkown Target
*cough, cough*
Yea, sorry, you're right, it's just that the Jews [I think] were the most, erm, persecuted?

You're confusing 'persecuted' with 'whiney little *****es'. No other ethnic group has ever *****ed about persecution as much as they do. You don't hear all the little Africa tribes going 'Help, help! They're trying to wipe us out. They're only fighting us because of our ancestors'. They do something about it and fight back in a meaningful/bloody way.

[Unknown Target]

*cough*Islam*cough, cough*
No offense intended here...

[ZylonBane]

Originally posted by CODEDOG ND
I looked it up, and women are smarter than men unfortunatly.

Not smarter. Sneakier.

[CODEDOG ND]

Originally posted by ZylonBane
Not smarter. Sneakier.

To be sneaky you have to be smart but the female maternal nature and her raging hormones makes her seem not as smart as the human male.

[CP5670]

But to return to CPS's (i think) earlier statement about dogma getting "in the way" of progress, keeping my above statement in mind, if you can make the words say anything, why isn't there a branch of a large religious establishment that emraces say, genetic engineering.

I certainly embrace it - having had big problems with my wisdom teeth I see no reason at all not to "Geneer" these vestigal traits out of my body. Another good example is hereditary conditions such as heamatitis and bad eyesight.

Another point is that the rate the repository of human information is growing we have reached a point where most people are unable to adequately understand most tasks they will be required to acheive in order to progress to the next cycle. What happens when it takes a genius by todays' standards to make a breakthrough in mathematics or SemiConductors? We are rapidly approaching such an impasse. THere is an argument against tinkering with genes and making "superbabies", but would you rather have a stagnant global society and technocracy while our evolution catches up with us?

Completely agree there; as I said earlier, the people who are against genetic alternation will reject it while the rest will go for it, resulting in them being the "superhumans" and the rest becoming insignificant in the course of history. (technological darwinism)

Religion is nothing more than a primitive attempt at explaining what cannot be explained.
I grew out of those church lies at a young age.
Go ahead and flame me but it will only further prove my point that weak minds need religion to maintian sanity and a certain level of order.

That was one of the two original purposes of religion and it is why I call it a throwback from prehistory.

Religion...is the opiate of the masses" was a quote from Karl Marx, not Hitler!

Such a deep truth, as I said earlier. I think it was "opium of the people," but I'm not sure.

Instead he used the Church to further bull**** the German people into thinking that he talks to God.
Again, religion is used here to control a bunch of people and maintain order.

You are right about this. In fact, all of the churches were either nationalized (and NSDAP leaders appointed as church leaders) or dissolved about a year after Hitler was appointed Chancellor so that there would be little resistance from them.

[Kellan]

Originally posted by CP5670

You are right about this. In fact, all of the churches were either nationalized (and NSDAP leaders appointed as church leaders) or dissolved about a year after Hitler was appointed Chancellor so that there would be little resistance from them.

The Catholic Church was still allowed to function. Hitler and the Pope signed a Concordat which basically said Hitler would not interfere with the Catholic Church as a whole, but was free to punish individual dissident members. In exchange, the Pope would not criticise the Nazi government - and in the south of Germany, where the population is (or was) almost entirely Catholic, that carried a lot of weight in legitimacy.

And yes an0n, the whole 'powerful Jewish lobby' thing is one explanation as to why the focus of the Holocaust is on the Jews. It could be that the Israeli government and perhaps its people have a talent for self promotion. It could be something entirely more mundane - such as people's inability to recall every single persecuted group; thus they concentrate on the largest.

[icespeed]

okay, i skipped reading a few replies, so if im repeating anything anyone's already said, ignore me.
WARNING: THIS IS ALL MY OWN OPINION

I'm Protestant Christian, so I believe that God created us and the world and everything; that Adam and Eve stuffed it up for everyone by disobeying God's command; that everyone is born in sin, and its a human thing to sin; that Jesus Christ was sent to die for our sins and now our punishment has been taken away, cos he already took it. (there's a verse in the bible explaining how Adam brought death for everyone, and how Christ gave everyone life again)
Now, some of the stuff that has been said:
God lets all the bad stuff-wars and all that- happen cos if He didn't, we wouldn't know anything. We'd still be in the garden of Eden, happily living as puppets who didn't know anything. Bad stuff makes us feel bad, but bad stuff also teaches us how to live.
 all the love stuff- love your god with all your heart and mind and soul, and love your neighbour as yourself- they're basically what living as a christian is based around.
Since we're human, we can't be perfect christians, but it doesn't matter, cos every time we sin, Christ has paid our penalty in full.
And God does know who'll choose to believe in him (and therefore receive eternal life) and who won't, but he can't interfere in the process cos then that would be manipulation, and God won't allow that. He gives us free will to choose to live, or to be tortured in hell.
Also, about the creation: God created everything. As the Creator, He didn't have to create things so that we understood them. But He did; He made things by rules, and He gave us the understanding to see those rules. We should be grateful He bothered, really.
God is God. This means that He can do everything and anything. He also has infinite wisdom, though, which is why He doesn't do everyhting and anything- some of that's bad.

That's what I think, anyway. Now I'll probably get people saying that I'm wrong and why.

[icespeed]

oh yes, and about gen eng:
it's probably okay up until the point you start cloning people. that'w when you're playing god, which no one can. cloning- who knows if we got the animals right, the brains and mind and everything? and the animals had problems with cancer and arthritis and dying at an early age, anyway. Dolly did, I think.

[Kellan]

Originally posted by icespeed
And God does know who'll choose to believe in him (and therefore receive eternal life) and who won't, but he can't interfere in the process cos then that would be manipulation, and God won't allow that. He gives us free will to choose to live, or to be tortured in hell.

Why do I have to be tortured in Christian hell because I refuse to believe in a Christian God? I mean, it's an interesting theological question - what happens to people who don't believe? Is it just 'bad Christians' in hell, or does everyone who isn't either good or Christian end up there?

In addition, why should people be tortured in hell? Surely the true torment of hell for a Christian would be knowing that they are eternally lost from salvation and have no chance of seeing God. The whole "hell is a fiery pit" thing was written in order to strike greater fear into the hearts of ordinary people who could not comprehend the 'loss of God'.

This isn't an attack on Christianity in particular, but hell. Replace that religion with any other if you desire.

[icespeed]

that _is_ the whole point of the torture. To be separated from God forever. God is everything good; love, compassion, and everything, and hell is basically everything that isn't God. Having to stay in hell for eternity, away from God, is torture.
And everyone's a special case. You're judged on whether you've been told about the gospel and believe/ don't believe; whether someone's told you about it at all; on your morals and values and stuff if no one's told you anything about it.
hell is for everyone who does not believe that Jesus saved them by dying on the cross, because that's like rejecting the gift God gave us of life. By rights, everyone should be in hell. Those who believe that Jesus saved us, go to heaven. After all, you can't be saved by something you don't believe in. Look at it that way.

oh, I forgot to say this before. Even as a Christian, I believe you should live life to the full- and love everyone. don't waste your time hating things/people.

[Kellan]

Originally posted by icespeed
And everyone's a special case. You're judged on whether you've been told about the gospel and believe/ don't believe; whether someone's told you about it at all; on your morals and values and stuff if no one's told you anything about it.
hell is for everyone who does not believe that Jesus saved them by dying on the cross, because that's like rejecting the gift God gave us of life. By rights, everyone should be in hell. Those who believe that Jesus saved us, go to heaven. After all, you can't be saved by something you don't believe in. Look at it that way.

But if I don't believe in it, how can I be punished by 'it'? And why should I be punished by it, if I don't believe in all the sin stuff? No wait, let me guess, it's a sin not to believe in original sin and Jesus' death for our sins.

[icespeed]

well, its like this. If you don't believe in something, that doesn't mean it doesnt exist, does it? like covering your eyes with your hands and not seeing... i dunno, a house or something, that doesnt mean the house doesnt exist, does it?
like the future. something that you dont believe ever could happen- your parents die or something- might happen.
you can be punished by something that you dont believe in.
but you cant be saved by something you dont believe in. being saved requires faith- like how sick people need to be determined and believe they'll live, and they have a better chance of surviving.

im no good at explaining things. but that's about the best i can do.

[Alikchi]

After reading through this thread about 3 times, I'd say my opinions most match wEvil way back on page 4.
I've grown out of the church, but I don't rely on math or logic, I don't get that. I just try to get by with myself. But I still have a healthy respect for the church (most of the time )  If a religion is preaching love and peace and hope, why argue against it? Long live freedom and damn the ideologies.

Oh, and this is probably one of the least-flaming and calm "religion" topics I've ever seen.

[Top Gun]

Originally posted by Zeronet
The 10 commandments set out how we should live our lives, if everyone followed them, the world would be a good place indeed.

Yeah right! Have you even read them in an analytical way? "Thou shat not worship any god but me." - Ahh, so we all have to worship the judeo/Christian god now?  
 
"Thou shall not murder" - Notice the word murder, turn a couple of pages and I'm sure I'll be able to find a quote where the bible instructs people to stone others to death for a ridiculously silly thing. Obviously if nobody murdered anyone the world would be a better place.
 
"Thou shall not steal" - Fair enough.  
 
"Thou shall not commit adultery" - This is an interesting one, whilst cheating on your spouse causes considerable distress should it be up there with Murder? Plus it's another instance of sexual repression at the hands of Judeo Christianity, forcing its followers to only have one partner at a time throughout their whole lives. Again, explain to me why having multiple partners is wrong without using a Jewish/Christian/Islamic text.  
 
"Thou shall not make any graven images of anything on earth or in heaven" - That one has just banned all forms of artwork. Can you say Taliban?  
 
"You shall not take the name of your Lord in vain" Well If you believe in that sort of thing I guess disobeying the above is a bit like hoax calls to the fire brigade but if you dont......  
 
"You shall remember and keep the Sabbath day holy" - Thank you for being responsible for making sure that I can't get groceries on a Sunday. It's fine if you believe it, a pain in the ass if you don't. Working on a Sunday, you may be surprised to know, is not the root of the world's problems  
 
"Honor your father and mother" Fair enough.  
 
"You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor" Fair enough.  
 
You shall not covet your neighbor's goods. You shall not covet your neighbor's house. You shall not covet your neighbor's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his bull, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor's." This is an interesting one. Depending on who you interpret as your neighbor determines the usefullness of this one.
 
That's four out of ten.

[Kellan]

Note: In response to IceSpeed's last post.

No, it makes sense. I just think it's the most tyrannical thing I've ever heard.

Perhaps I can better explain myself by stating how I believe religions (and if there were Gods, then Gods) exist. They exist on faith. God 'exists' because people believe it exists. If nobody believed that God existed, it would cease to exist as a concept or a physical being. Thus by refusing to accept God, I am eliminating its influence upon me, and my influence upon it.