Author Topic: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.  (Read 60397 times)

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Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
Yeah I think the mission needs some scripting so Delta are forced into evading after a few hits.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
You're running an older version of Blue Planet. Download Blue Planet Complete from the FSO installer or the Blue Planet forum!

Oh, thought I'd done that - must have missed a step! Thanks guys! I really love this community - somewhere else there would have been insults hurled and such, but here? The civility is wicked-good!

But, even using the latest FSOinstaller - I get the image attached below :(

[attachment deleted by admin]
« Last Edit: July 29, 2016, 09:01:21 pm by galonrever »

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
You need to select "bpcomplete" as your folder, not "blueplanet". Blueplanet is the old release that doesn't include FSBlue or many other changes.
[19:31] <MatthTheGeek> you all high up on your mointain looking down at everyone who doesn't beam everything on insane blindfolded

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
You need to select "bpcomplete" as your folder, not "blueplanet". Blueplanet is the old release that doesn't include FSBlue or many other changes.

Ah, my mistake - thanks guys!

EDIT: WOAH! Played through up to the Vasudan nebula operations - the changes are fantastic! Loving the morning star, it's actually useful now - and great work on the Slaying Ravana mission, that was a massive improvement. Looking forward to the rest of the campaign :D
« Last Edit: July 30, 2016, 06:17:05 am by galonrever »

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
How y'all liking the new new Slaying Ravana? King's Gambit any less self-playing?

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
How does one properly test self-playing? Is it not giving any input at all or giving out orders only but otherwise not influencing?

If the former, the missions are defenitely not self playing but that's mainly because Alpha wing's bombers stay on your wing and don't attack at all :P

When C-3-9'ing King's Gambit, the Deimos class corvettes, the NTC Liberty and the NTT Inspiration don't make it, but the NTD Uhuru and the Leviathan class cruisers survive. Partly this is due to how the Mjolnir beam cannons are aligned: They miss all their shots on the NTD Uhuru (!) whilst connecting a fair few times with the Deimos class corvettes. However, the NTD Uhuru and a cruiser surviving still indicates mission succes, although it probably will make the later missions a lot harder (although I don't know how as I aced the mission in my campaign playtrough and just fired up the techroom to check). If you want to get that Distinguished Flying Cross you definitely need to put some work in.

As a possible suggestion to make the mission harder: Ensure that any hostile craft in the mission prioritize the Mjolnirs. Right now, the Deimos class corvettes are not a threat to any friendly assets in the mission, whilst you as a player should have an incentive to try to bomb their frontal beam cannons.

Strangely, I found the Sicilain Defense much easier then King's Gambit, whilst it's defeinitely less self playing when checking in the tech room. But if you can keep the Hyksos alive (which simply requires bombing the starboard side beam turrets) the other hostile craft seem to blow up almost instantly.

As a side side note: Into the Maelstrom: one of your wingmates calls out a mayday after a friendly corvette (forgot it's name) says that they are not allowed to leave their position but that they will deploy another wing of fighters. Shouldn't this dialog be the other way 'round?
« Last Edit: August 10, 2016, 03:48:46 pm by -Joshua- »

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
The new new slaying ravana is defenitely *WOW*. I was always impressed by The Great Hunt, and Slaying Ravana now matches that feel.

Warships in the FS2 bombing missions do seem a bit weird though: They often make no effort to improve their firing position on other craft. The Ravana stands still being pummeled whilst it could try to bring it's frontal cannons to bear on the warships harassing it, and the captains of the ships in King's Gambit seem to furiously spam ALT+J like they have been told this mission would be self playing, making no effort to improve on either their own odds or the odds of the craft behind them.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2016, 03:55:12 pm by -Joshua- »

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
Yah I saved the Abraxis! ... Why don't I get credit for that? :P

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
Question: The Malta appears in Apocalypse, but where do the other ships in the Bastion's escort go?

edit (because my double posts have become insaanee)

Yay I finished it! First time I finished the whole thing on insanity, which is nice.

I still have *thoughts* about Apocalypse though:

First of all, there's a bit of weirdness regarding the fighters and capitals that get carried over. I can understand that mission balance requires that only a limited set of fighters or cruisers get carried over, but the current method is a bit crude: The Malta gets carried over if the malta survives, but if the Ertenax and the Templar both survive whilst the Malta is destroyed apocalypse is still harder then it would be if you lost two cruisers but saved the Malta. From a reward perspective, this makes no sense.

My suggestion would be to ensure that if you manage to save atleast one cruiser, the cruiser with the least amount of hull damage is carried over to Apocalypse. The final mission appears to have scripting disabled to make all three of them appear but that might screw up with balance a bit too much (Even if Apocalypse is damn hard, but it should be).

The same with fighters: It makes no sense that you get all your fighters when Alpha and beta and gamma 1,2 survive, but none if only gamma 3,4 and delta survive.

Secondly, the mission has voice files for every ship that makes it trough the node, even if the convoys have no chance of surviving. This could be a boon to make the mission less predictable. Right now, anyone who has played apocalypse knows when it will end, thus encouraging the player to bolt it after a certain set of time is passed. Perhaps make that timer a *lot* more random. Sometimes earlier to catch out veterans, whilst often longer to coax people into tempting fate and trying to save a few more transport ships. The way the current mission is designed makes Petrarch's speech on how Alpha 1 heroically decided to stay behind seem like a complete sham. Simply being nearby the third or fourth convoy makes running in the default herc II impossible.

Perhaps, try making that mission play exactly like Petrarch paints it and tie the apocalypse to the flight path of a random transport ship: When that transport ship is about 50 seconds away from the node, trigger the supernova and have that ship be attacked by shivans so that the player is actually forced to choose between just bolting for the node and trying to cover that last transport ship at the risk of their own life.

I have no idea if such a thing even can be fredded but I DARE YOU.

(Also, do the AI actually use trebuchets?)
« Last Edit: August 17, 2016, 04:04:08 pm by -Joshua- »

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
It might be fun to just make the supernova counter longer, so you have more time to make a decision between "supernova beginning!" and the shockwave impact.

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
Retail AI can't use trebs and that's unlikely to change in FSBlue all that soon. Maras and Basilisks are equipped with like 80 trebs by default, imagine what every mission would look like if they actually used them.

Another problem with upgrading the AI is that it would require a lot of rebalancing and in some missions you have a tight script to follow due to the unchangeable voice lines.
[19:31] <MatthTheGeek> you all high up on your mointain looking down at everyone who doesn't beam everything on insane blindfolded

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
The AI are set to 'guard alpha 1' in a lot of missions, I noticed, and become way way way more effective when ordered to engage. This is on medium, of course.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
I reliaze that BP needs this for story reasons, but I am slightly sad that the rank.tbl has been effectively nullified. My score says that I should be Lt. Commander by now, but FS blue never acknowledges this :(

Retail AI can't use trebs and that's unlikely to change in FSBlue all that soon. Maras and Basilisks are equipped with like 80 trebs by default, imagine what every mission would look like if they actually used them.

Thing is, you don't need to modify the AI for all the campaign, one just needs to either tell wingmen in the latter missions to start using them (isn't there a sexp for that?) or ensure that the player is either explicitly or implicitly told never to use the Trebs for AI wingmen.

The AI are set to 'guard alpha 1' in a lot of missions, I noticed, and become way way way more effective when ordered to engage. This is on medium, of course.

Guard alpha 1 is usefull for maintaining a tighter formation though. You don't want to be pounced by a few dragons whilst the rest of your wing is killing asteroths a few klicks away. Enemy fighter's manouvrability increases considerably at higher difficulty levels as the handicap they get tapers off. If a dragon is on your tail, your only hope is a friendly warship or wingman nearby (and preventing them from getting on your tail is much easier with wingmen or warships nearby).
« Last Edit: August 20, 2016, 11:27:23 am by -Joshua- »

 

Offline Kolgena

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Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
In Feint Parry Riposte, I'm losing the friendly leviathan every time the Orion shows up on insane. It gets instagibbed by the BGreens and there's nothing the player can do.

 

Offline Cobra

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Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
I'm noticing that Shivan fighters tend to go off to some random ****ing location at full burn.

In A Lion at the Door, I noticed a wing of Astaroths (and one lone Astaroth) 15 ****ing klicks out from the battle flying off into some random point in space. In the following mission, when encountering the first wing of Manticores, only two engage, but the other two are nowhere to be found.
To consider the Earth as the only populated world in infinite space is as absurd as to assert that in an entire field of millet, only one grain will grow. - Metrodorus of Chios
I wept. Mysterious forces beyond my ken had reached into my beautiful mission and energized its pilots with inhuman bomb-firing abilities. I could only imagine the GTVA warriors giving a mighty KIAAIIIIIII shout as they worked their triggers, their biceps bulging with sinew after years of Ivan Drago-esque steroid therapy and weight training. - General Battuta

 

Offline Cobra

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Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
Also, uhhh... cruisers like the Fenris and Leviathan have turrets labeled AAA Beam/Turret, but have laser turrets instead. Also, the Hawkwood in The Sixth Wonder decided it wanted to use its main beams against my Perseus instead of Enif Station. I was nowhere near Enif Station or even in the line of fire.
To consider the Earth as the only populated world in infinite space is as absurd as to assert that in an entire field of millet, only one grain will grow. - Metrodorus of Chios
I wept. Mysterious forces beyond my ken had reached into my beautiful mission and energized its pilots with inhuman bomb-firing abilities. I could only imagine the GTVA warriors giving a mighty KIAAIIIIIII shout as they worked their triggers, their biceps bulging with sinew after years of Ivan Drago-esque steroid therapy and weight training. - General Battuta

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
If the mission file has altered the warship's default loadout then its turret names will not match.

 

Offline Cobra

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Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
Granted, I just remember them being more formidable.

Also, in Love the Treason and But Hate the Traitor, rebels attack the Sunder and Omega transport when they're supposed to be either ignoring or waiting. Was a nasty little surprise (and a little amusing) for all 5 fighters in Traitor to destroy the Omega transport and Niven telling me I'm the cold-blooded killer.

[EDIT] Also, I continue to run into the issue of the rather sadistic nature of ship's gunners targeting me with their main anti-capship beams. Seems to affect the Deimos corvettes the most.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2016, 06:15:42 pm by Cobra »
To consider the Earth as the only populated world in infinite space is as absurd as to assert that in an entire field of millet, only one grain will grow. - Metrodorus of Chios
I wept. Mysterious forces beyond my ken had reached into my beautiful mission and energized its pilots with inhuman bomb-firing abilities. I could only imagine the GTVA warriors giving a mighty KIAAIIIIIII shout as they worked their triggers, their biceps bulging with sinew after years of Ivan Drago-esque steroid therapy and weight training. - General Battuta

 

Offline Bryan See

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Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
Can the Hecate or other destroyer classes or above survive such attacks?

 
Re: FreeSpace Blue: FreeSpace 2 as it should've been.
Can the Hecate or other destroyer classes or above survive such attacks?
No idea what you are talking about, but I'm gonna go with "yes".