[Kellan]

Originally posted by Thunder
Zeronet - They may not be to you, but you may be amongst those with a mind of his own. Look in any newspaper and you'll see a different story. If they weren't national symbols then they wouldn't feature so highly in every form of media this country has.

Pick up a red-top like The Sun and see just how far nationalist sterotypes of foreign people go (try looking at the football section as an example). It's virulent.

[Fineus]

Thats my point though - nationality is no longer something I consider worth thinking of, it's a control.

[Kellan]

Agreed.

[Top Gun]

Going onto Europe (it was a natural progression). I remain skeptical about the EU. This is not due to nationalism but due to the fact that I have yet to be convinved that it's anywhere near as democratic as the system we've got in the UK. The EUCD is a prime example of this. Whilst the EU may have brought us many benefits, wildly signing powers over to it without even thinking about the consequenses (just who's going to be making the decisions about our future) should not be encouraged.

[Zeronet]

Im not a Anti-Euro, im Pro-Britain .

[Kellan]

Originally posted by Top Gun
Going onto Europe (it was a natural progression). I remain skeptical about the EU. This is not due to nationalism but due to the fact that I have yet to be convinved that it's anywhere near as democratic as the system we've got in the UK. The EUCD is a prime example of this. Whilst the EU may have brought us many benefits, wildly signing powers over to it without even thinking about the consequenses (just who's going to be making the decisions about our future) should not be encouraged.

I agree that the EU needs a major overhaul before it can be considered as a democratic alternative to national governments. It's also too bureaucratic, and a lot of money slips through the cracks because of this.

However, I don't oppose it in principle. Supranational government would be a good way of stamping out some nationalistic urges, as long as it doesn't turn into a meritocratic government of elites. Which would be bad, but would also be the tendency in a governmental area with a population greater than the US and scattered across land and sea.

[Kellan]

Originally posted by Zeronet
Im not a Anti-Euro, im Pro-Britian .

Where is this 'Britian'?

The Euro is a fine idea that will save money on exchanges, give us greater pan-European price transparency, and encourage free trade between member states. However, we would lose control of monetary policy to the ECB...

[Alikchi]

Originally posted by Kellan
Nationalism is a petty, silly thing. To suggest that I have something in common with people based purely on geographical location and (formerly) race is nonsense. They're created basically to give legitimacy to rulers who wanted control of a large economic area. The price you pay is nationalism and the ridiculous idea that slights against your nation are like personal attacks.

Agreed.

It appears to show that everyone in all[/u] (Western) nations is conditioned from an early age to be obedient to an authority they perceive as legitimate. All you have to do to get public conformity and acceptance is appear to be legitimate as an authority.

Look at that again and think.

Oh, and about the slavery thing. The American Civil War wasn't about slavery until Lincoln made it that way. It was more about sectionalism and states' rights. Note "Confederate".

[Zeronet]

Originally posted by Kellan


Where is this 'Britian'?

The Euro is a fine idea that will save money on exchanges, give us greater pan-European price transparency, and encourage free trade between member states. However, we would lose control of monetary policy to the ECB...

Boo!Hisss! The Euro is a foolish idea that will tie our interest rates with Europes and cause untold damage.

[HotSnoJ]

Why is it that Jesus and God (I am a Christian) names always get used in vain? You don't say, "Oh my Mohmad (or Allah)!" or " 'whatever diety'!" Your taking their names in vain proves that they exist because all the others aren't worth cursing by!


More later.

[ivorycruncher]

First of all, I want to say that I am a Christian and I believe in the one true God.

Christianity is not a religion.  It's a Person.  Catholicism, Buddhism, and the like are religions.  Becoming a Christian means you've asked Jesus, God's only Son, to come into your heart, to forgive you for all your sins and to save your soul.  It's about having a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.  We are born with a sin-nature.  Because of that we are cut off from God.  But he sent his only Son, Jesus Christ, to die on the cross to take away our sins.  He fills the gap betwen us and God.

Christianity is not about religion but about a relationship.  There are (for example) Catholics who are Christians and there are Baptists who aren't Christians.  When it comes down to the brass tacks, religion is irrelevant.  I could get into the doctrinal issues about why I disagree with the Catholic religion (like how they worship Mary, the mother of Jesus; she was only human so worshipping her is worshipping a false idol) and other religions but that doesn't matter.  All that really matters is you having a personal connection with God.  The only way to achieve that gap is through Jesus Christ.  There is some debate it to whether Jesus is God.  He is.  He is God the Son, part of the divine Trinity (God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit).  They are three and one, all at the same time.  When Jesus came into this world in human form, he became fully human but he was also fully God at the same time.  Regardless, Christians should not worship Jesus.  We are to pray to the Lord our God in the name of Jesus Christ since he's our connection to God the Father.

Now I'm no preacher and I'm not trying to start a flame war.  I can't make you believe what I believe.  It's your choice.  This is simply my attempt to express my beliefs and help you understand why I believe in them.  If you want to know more, feel free to email me (flaming via email is not appreciated).  Let me just close with this final thought.  If there is no God, then you have nothing to worry about.  But if there is a God and you don't accept him, you're out of luck when your life ends.  There is a heaven and a hell.  If you have Jesus in your heart, then you'll go straight to heaven the instant you die.  If you don't, then you go to hell, no and's if's, or but's about it.  My question is are you willing to take that risk?


Best wishes,

          ivorycruncher

[CODEDOG ND]

yes! yes!  Become states just like us!!!!!!!! muhhahahahahaha!!!!

The only problem I have with is this wave of people that try not to be trendy and anti-government because they have made it too trendy.  "Yea! We like Weezer!!!"  Stuff like that gets on my nerves.  Same with liberals(no pun intended:p).

I am from the South(of the US that is).  The majority is conservative, and don't like people to tell us what to do.  Unlike most people think, we are far from stupid racist with missing teeth(however some do have missing teeth).  My main problem is with those liberal SOBs from up somewhere in New York or some other little piss ant of a state that trys to tell us what to do.  

Before 9/11, 9 out of every 10 flags you seen on the back of a car or truck were CSA flags and not US ones.  Wonder why?  You might think it is because we want slavery?  Well no, most of us don't want slavery, but we don't want to be pushed around specially by a liberal media and government.  Think about it.  Even though slavery is wrong, it is the fact that the anti-slavery movment sparked rapidly in the North and not in the South because there wasn't much need for people to work farms and bussinesses, and using immagrants to do you work is not much better than slavery when you give them two cents a day.  

It was the fact that somebody from some place we have never been to is trying to tell us what to do(sounds familiar doesn't), and that is why the American Civil War started(and the fact they thought is would destroy the economy of the South, but the Jim Crowe Laws helped ease that).

Whatever happened to "Do your part to make a better society?"
Where did this "Do what you want, not what civilization needs" come from?
And why is this "Live life fast and furious" the main attitude of today?

Because it doesn't matter what you believe will happen to you.  If you think by not doing what society expects from you you are going to make a difference or change, well sorry to burst your bubble but you're not going to do ****.  

I'm not saying conform, but do things that reflect good judgment upon yourself so that your children(if you have any) and the people around you will respect you.

Ok, I talked into a circle and didn't say much but oh well.  My brain has to personality that confuse my writing.

[HotSnoJ]

here here Ivorycrucher

[Corsair]

Originally posted by CODEDOG ND
I am from the South(of the US that is). The majority is conservative, and don't like people to tell us what to do. Unlike most people think, we are far from stupid racist with missing teeth(however some do have missing teeth). My main problem is with those liberal SOBs from up somewhere in New York or some other little piss ant of a state that trys to tell us what to do.

First of all, I do not like being called a liberal SOB just because I'm from New England and live a half hour from New York. Second of all, who made any generalization against Southerners that they are racist?

Just because I am liberal....well, actually since I can't vote yet I guess I don't really count do I? But anyway, not everybody tries to push the South around. Maybe some politicians do, but that doesn't mean you can generalize about the whole Northeast. And we aren't all small "piss ant" states. Just most of us. Like Connecticut where I live. We have 5 representatives in Congress! (I think anyway). Five! How do we push you around with five representatives? Huh? Also, how do you make the generalization that all of us are liberal? Just explain that to me and I'll be satisfied...

[Alikchi]

Originally posted by hotsnoj
Why is it that Jesus and God (I am a Christian) names always get used in vain? You don't say, "Oh my Mohmad (or Allah)!" or " 'whatever diety'!" Your taking their names in vain proves that they exist because all the others aren't worth cursing by!

 

That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Kudos!

[Kamikaze]

Originally posted by Alikchi


That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Kudos!

LMAO, I agree! (I hope it was a joke)

[CODEDOG ND]

Originally posted by Corsair
[BHuh? Also, how do you make the generalization that all of us are liberal? [/B]

I didn't generalize all of the North East as liberals.  Just a majority except New Hampshire.

[ZylonBane]

Originally posted by Kellan
Nationalism is a petty, silly thing. To suggest that I have something in common with people based purely on geographical location and (formerly) race is nonsense.

I would dispute this. Common geography gives you a common language, culture, and possibly even psychological makeup with your neighbors. Modern technology has diminished this, but in the past it was significant. Nationalism also confers a survival advantage... by calling on it a nation can be motivated to band together in defense against hostile nations. Again, modern life has mitigated this need somewhat.

For all their flaws, I'd rather be ruled by a nation than by a corporation, which seems to be the only alternative so far.

[Mad Bomber]

Originally posted by CODEDOG ND
I didn't generalize all of the North East as liberals.  Just a majority except New Hampshire.

Being in the Northeast, I thank you for that generous compliment.

[ivorycruncher]

Originally posted by Alikchi


That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Kudos!

Then try this on for size.  How come Christians always get picked on?  The ACLU (American Civil Liberties Union) kicks and screams at little things like kids having a Bible study after school on the school grounds.  It's not being taught in school and attendance isn't required yet it's supposedly illegal.  What happened to free speech?  Now if somebody wanted to have a Buddhist meeting or something like that it wouldn't be a problem at all.  They're scared of Christianity because they know it's the one faith that has something to it.  It's the Truth and they're scared of the Truth.

And btw, while we're on the subject, let's talk about separation of church and state.  What exactly does that mean?  A lot less than what you think it does.  It simply means that the government can't tell you what religion you have to participate in and also that a church can't have a direct influence on the decisions of the government.  The common misconception is that no government official can let his religious beliefs affect his decisions of his job and (even more connonly) that nobody can even pray quietly at school.  As for prayer, I again bring up the free speech issue.  Also, in case you didn't know (lots of people don't), the separation of church and state thing isn't part of our constitution or bill of rights or any of our actual laws.  The phrase was in a letter written by Thomas Jefferson (our country's third president) and it's been taken completely out of context.  Well, enough said.